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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by psvensson View Post
    A variant of Patrick Gainer's MC-TEA:

    The only downside is that the film speed is low: D400 needs to be exposed at 160-200 with this developer,
    Thank you.
    In that case, will not the combo of ISO 100/125 film @ EI 180/200 with FX-37 give better, or at least equal results?

  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_G View Post
    Thank you.
    In that case, will not the combo of ISO 100/125 film @ EI 180/200 with FX-37 give better, or at least equal results?
    I strongly doubt you'll get that kind of speed boost with any developer, especially with slow film. I've tried quite a few variants. And in any case, FX-37 has a lot of sulfite and phenidone, so you'll probably get mushy grain and low accutance.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by psvensson View Post
    I strongly doubt you'll get that kind of speed boost with any developer, especially with slow film. I've tried quite a few variants. And in any case, FX-37 has a lot of sulfite and phenidone, so you'll probably get mushy grain and low accutance.
    Not according to "The Film Developing Cookbook", where it is said to give 2/3 stop boost and very high acutance, similar to FX-2. So, I wonder.

  4. #14

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    FX-39 , similar to FX-37, is still made by Paterson ,they discontinued Acutol I believe.
    For landscapes I used T-max 100 at EI 80 (sun/shade) with FX-37.The high EI's in Apug articles section may refer to dull days where the shadows are relatively brighter.

    Interesting point is that it appears not to be possible to get high EI's from developers dissolved in organic solvents as the ingredients needed to give high pH will not dissolve as they are ionic.

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by srs5694 View Post
    As has been mentioned, glycols and TEA are a couple of solvents that often get used. You can find formulas for PC-TEA, PC-Glycol, and a few others here. That site once had a recipe for a PC-Glycol/Mytol hybrid, but it's no longer there. (It seems to have been replaced by "Instant Mytol.") I have some notes on it, but they're confusing; I think I must have miscopied something.
    The guy who runs that site is a frequent APUG reader.

    "Instant MYTOL" is the closest thing to what the OP wants. It is a version of MYTOL that eliminates some problematic ingredients or formulations, and can be mixed up in triethanolamine and propylene glycol. On the page cited above, scroll down to "Instant MYTOL" and then look under "Stock solution in propylene glycol / triethanolamine" -- the recipe is there.

    The "Instant MYTOL" organic stock solution is diluted 1+19 into water containing 60 g/L sodium sulfite just before use, providing a working solution that I treat just like stock XTOL. I use XTOL temp and time recommendations and get great results with a wide range of B&W films. Alternatively, you can dilute the stock solution 1+39 into water containing 30 g/L sodium sulfite, and treat it like XTOL 1+1 (this is the way I usually use it). The organic stock solution should last a very long time -- mine has been going strong for about eight months now with no visible problems.

    I have received complaints in the past about 1+19 nature of the stock "Instant MYTOL" dilution -- people feel that it's not concentrated enough to be worthwhile. My response is usually that "Instant MYTOL" is best used at 1+39 anyway (like XTOL 1+1), and that the formulation is limited by the solubility of ascorbic acid in propylene glycol / triethanolamine. (Gainer's developers have about 3-4x less ascorbic acid, and the working solutions are comparable in developing agent concentration to XTOL 1+3).

    I did once have a PC-Glycol/MYTOL hybrid on the site ("PC-Gly-TOL") but removed it because it was optimized for formulae that no-one was using anymore (older PC-TEA recipes from Pat Gainer that had been superseded anyway). The basis of the whole thing was that PC-Glycol and PC-TEA are already organic solutions that could be "coaxed" into something like XTOL 1+1 with pH adjustments, etc. They were only worthwhile for those who are already using the old versions of PC-TEA or PC-Glycol.

  6. #16

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    long life mytol

    What I have done to increase the life of mytol, is to dissolve the sulfite and metaborate in water. I also have stock solution of phenidone in glycol. Also measure out sodium ascorabate in the quantities that I normally use. I is very simple just to mix every thing together just before I start processing the film.

    Jurgen

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Zentena View Post
    If you are scratch mixing then one way to extend life is
    to forget about making up stock solutions. Instead make
    things up to working strength when you need it. This
    works for many formulas. Some supposedly need to
    age in stock form.
    That's the only way when using Amidol, IIRC.
    Another way is to mix developers two part or
    A and B. As a general rule solutions which are
    acidic are less prone to oxidize. Also an oxygen
    scavenger should be included. For most
    developers that means a developing
    agent + bisulfite; the later acidic.

    When making up the working strength solution
    so much of the alkaline B solution is added to
    so much of the A solution. If concentrates
    of A and B are used water is added to
    bring to volume. Dan

  8. #18
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    The usual ploy of making an acidic stock with the developing agents and a separate stock with the alkali is not foolproof when ascorbic acid is one of the agents. It is an antioxidant even in acid solution. The ascorbic acid-phenidone solution will protect the phenidone from aerial oxidation at pH values below film developing activity, but after enough ascorbic acid has been converted to dehydroascorbic acid, you will have the "sudden death syndrome" because the activity of the phenidone-ascorbate developer depends on regenerating the phenidone.

    At pH values below the activity point of ascorbate, a very much greater amount of ascorbic acid than the minimum required for superadditivity does not increase the developer activity. If a buffering alkali such as borax is used, you could wait til doomsday to see any activity from ascorbate alone. Add a very small amount of phenidone and the activity jumps. I have found that the storage life of a complete developer containing 0.04 grams of phenidone, 8 to 10 grams of ascorbic acid and 24 grams or so of borax in a liter of developer is quite good. The working capacity is also quite good, so that several rolls may be developed in a liter of solution, either all at once or in succession.

    Strangely, when I had such a solution that was a 6 minute developer, I decided to see what would happen if I let it stand for 8 minutes without agitation after the first 10 seconds. Years ago, when I tried this with Rodinal or PMK, I found uneven development due to what appeared to be bromide drag. It does not happen with this P-C formula. It may relate to the relative insensitivity of phenidone to bromide content.

    You can theorize about the sharpness and grain size all you want, but test your theory on this formula.
    Gadget Gainer

  9. #19
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    Incidentally, if you want to make a two solution developer, make the first solution with 0.8 grams of phenidone, 2 teaspoons of ascorbic acid powder and 2 tablespoons of borax in a liter. Make the second solution 2 teaspoons of ascorbic acid and 2 tablespoons of borax in a liter of water. Experiment to find the proportions of the two solutions that give you the development time and contrast you want.
    Gadget Gainer

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jurgen View Post
    What I have done to increase the life of mytol, is to dissolve the sulfite and metaborate in water. I also have stock solution of phenidone in glycol. Also measure out sodium ascorabate in the quantities that I normally use.
    Thank you.
    Glycol is a developing agent in itself and it isn't included in Mytol formula, so I wonder what adding it does to the balance of the Mytol formula.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancqu View Post
    Another way is to mix developers two part or
    A and B. As a general rule solutions which are
    acidic are less prone to oxidize. Also an oxygen
    scavenger should be included. For most
    developers that means a developing
    agent + bisulfite; the later acidic.

    When making up the working strength solution
    so much of the alkaline B solution is added to
    so much of the A solution. If concentrates
    of A and B are used water is added to
    bring to volume.
    Thank you.
    This is a valuable info for me.
    For how long will the separate stock solutions of Mytol maintain full working power in full dark glass bottles?

    Quote Originally Posted by gainer View Post
    Incidentally, if you want to make a two solution developer, make the first solution with 0.8 grams of phenidone, 2 teaspoons of ascorbic acid powder and 2 tablespoons of borax in a liter. Make the second solution 2 teaspoons of ascorbic acid and 2 tablespoons of borax in a liter of water. Experiment to find the proportions of the two solutions that give you the development time and contrast you want.
    Thank you for both replies.
    Unfortunately, I really don't have the time to experiment with developers, not before I'll retire from work, few years from now. Meanwhile, I'd rather stick to known formula(s). I'd like to start with Mytol and see whether it will satisfy me, or not. Mytol doesn't include Borax and I don't want/cannot spend the time to invent my own developer – not at this stage.
    Mytol contains:
    Sodium Sulfite anhydrous
    Sodium Metaborate
    Sodium Ascorbate
    Phenidone
    Sodium Metabisulfite
    Is there any recommendation for making 2 or 3 stock solutions with that formula, or may be 2 stock solutions with 1 ingredient added per working solution?

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