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  1. #1

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    "HIE INFRARED discontinued -Cold Storage options?"

    Kodak HIE, black & white Infrared film pre-discontinued.
    I knew this day would come, I screamed like a sailor when I found the link to:

    Preannounced Professional Film Discontinuances
    November 2, 2007 - KODAK is preannouncing the discontinuance of several smaller running families of Professional film... High Speed Infrared (HIE) effective end of December 2007. Demand for these products has been declining significantly in recent years, and it is no longer practical to continue to manufacture given the low volume, the age of the product formulations and the complexity of the processes involved. We will continue to ship product through the end of this year.


    After I heard, I went out the next morning and drove to 5 stores in the LA area and bought every roll they had. Then I talked to the film buyer at Samy's Corporate, and told him to order a lot for his stores NOW. So hopefully they will have a stock on hand for those that need their HIE fix like I do.

    The prices were as follows:
    $11.99
    $12.82
    $13.09
    $11.99
    and $11.49 at Samy.com mail order.

    BTW, all 290 rolls were November 2008 expiration.

    My friend at Samy's said that Kodak now has only two film sales reps for the entire USA, EAST & WEST. With that kind of commitment it seems that Kodak does in fact see film buyers like me as a distraction. As much as I would like to take out my anger & frustration on BIG YELLOW... the film has been produced, it sits in a warehouse, it has a cost price probably around $8.00 and neither Kodak the corporation or the executives, or the stock holders will feel any effect if I buy 290 rolls to finish my current project, or if they just trickle out of the stores over the next 6 months. So, no reason to boycott Kodak or anything like that, Kodak still produces fine stuff, albeit less of it than in film's heyday. I guess I instead could have bought 35.5 KODAK EasyShare C613 Digi's instead if I wanted to make their stock price really soar.

    Now that my favorite film of all time, Kodak HIE, has been discontinued, how do I store my stockpile most efficiently?

    I have heard:
    As cold a freezer as possible.
    The film canisters are freezer/humidity proof, but the brick/boxes are not.
    So put the brick in a zip-lock freezer bag to keep packaging from getting soggy.
    I'm thinking a little desiccant pack in each bag as well.
    The freezer should not defrost if possible, to keep temp from fluctuating.
    The bricks are individually bagged so i can remove one and thaw without disturbing the others.
    How's that sound?

    While I've heard a lot about base fog due to cosmic rays, I have also seen many posts by shooters who have had luck with VERY expired batches of HIE, and I have seen no issues with film two to three years out of date. It usually doesn't sit around here that long. I imagine I can finish my project in the next ten years, so that's what I'm shooting for. Hopefully some other film company will step in where kodak has left a big hole in this niche market.

    -Schaf
    www.schafphoto.com

  2. #2
    BWKate's Avatar
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    Schaf,

    Just looked at your web site. Your infrared images are great! Are you shooting a medium format camera with the 35mm Hie? It looks like you do because the entire film is exposed as well as the sprockets. Very interesting. I, too have used this film for a very long time and am scrambling to get some but also need some cash flow as well. When I found out that the film was on it's way out a week ago I went around to find as much as I could in my town and found 2 ROLLS. Man, I so live in the wilds of Canada!
    I received a postcard shot with the Rollei IR film for the postcard exchange and it looked quite good. Maybe Kraker could post it in this thread so you can see it? If you want I could ask him. It might be a viable alternative but it sounds like you have a fairly good supply right to last a little while.
    I like the way you shoot your infrared so that you see the image first and the special effect last.

  3. #3
    PeterB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schafphoto View Post
    While I've heard a lot about base fog due to cosmic rays, I have also seen many posts by shooters who have had luck with VERY expired batches of HIE, and I have seen no issues with film two to three years out of date. It usually doesn't sit around here that long. I imagine I can finish my project in the next ten years
    -Schaf
    10-15 years should be fine if kept frozen. Bear in mind that there is greater than a 3-fold difference in terrestrial gamma radiation levels around the US. see this map taken from here.

    If you are really paranoid, purchase a digital thermometer for the freezer that has an alarm go off if the temp exceeds a certain value.

    Also one theory I have, is that if you don't open the freezer too much you won't let fresh (radioactive) Radon gas in. Hence don't get a frost free freezer as those things continually replace the air. If you do have a frost free freezer then consider placing the zip-lock plastic bags inside lead pouches (the kind used for x-ray protection in the olden days )

    BTW Did you actually purchase 290 rolls ?? That's about US$3000 !!

    regards
    Peter

  4. #4

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    Pretty drastic purchase of some crappy film.....

    All high sensitive (IR) film is rather sensitive for cosmic radiation so more or less this means the film will be fogged in some years. There is only one good solution and that is FRESH IR film.

    Actual manufacturers:

    Ilford SFX 200 (35mm and 120 roll film)
    Efke IR820 (35mm, 120 roll film, sheet film)
    Rollei IR 820/400 (35mm, 120 rol film, 4x5" sheet film)

    and I am sure there will be some replacement till 850nm-900nm high sensitive IR film soon....
    But not from Kodak.

  5. #5
    Stephen Frizza's Avatar
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    fotohuis No film is crappy!!! maybe a certain film doesn't suit your needs but
    no film is crappy. HIE had remarkable applications. Ive been stockpiling it too.
    Ive now gotten close to 300 rolls. normally I sell discontinued films but right now Im being like a squirrel with nuts before winter. These babies there are all mine. hehehehe.

    I will be surprised if any manufacturer replicates the spectral values, grain properties , tonal range/contrast of HIE.

    I genuinely believe that anyone who has this film and makes good use of it will be making images which have high value in the future as nothing will replicate its look.

    For me loosing HIE is like loosing an old friend.

  6. #6

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    fotohuis No film is crappy!!! maybe a certain film doesn't suit your needs but
    no film is crappy. HIE had remarkable applications. Ive been stockpiling it too.
    Ive now gotten close to 300 rolls. normally I sell discontinued films but right now Im being like a squirrel with nuts before winter. These babies there are all mine. hehehehe.
    In case you do not know: HIE is really a "waste" product ($$ ) . So in that context I call it "crappy".

    Indeed none of mentioned products are giving the same effect as the HIE which has no A.H. layer and is sensitized till over 900nm, one of the reasons you have to load and unload in complete darkness.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fotohuis View Post
    In case you do not know: HIE is really a "waste" product ($$ ) . So in that context I call it "crappy".

    Indeed none of mentioned products are giving the same effect as the HIE which has no A.H. layer and is sensitized till over 900nm, one of the reasons you have to load and unload in complete darkness.
    What do you mean 'waste' product?

    Corey

  8. #8

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    What do you mean 'waste' product?
    For the manufacturer: Destination trash.

    But it seems to be that this product could (also) be used to produce a high sensitive IR film........

  9. #9

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    nnnnnnNNNNNOOOOOOOooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HIE discontinued???? Sad, sad, sad. My all time favourite film....gone...



    PS....isn't there an infrared film out there that has "Aura" in its name that also does not have an anti-halation layer?

    Has anyone tried the Rollei IR film? How does it comapre to HIE?

    I swear, if Kodak stops production of Tri-X, I'm going to cause some damage.

  10. #10
    Stephen Frizza's Avatar
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    YAY I just received my order of HIE a few more hundred rolls for me :-)

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