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  1. #11

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    uneven dev

    oops saw the 5 min thing.

  2. #12
    MarkL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Mark;

    I would check the negative out. Several people have reported LF and ULF negatives with uneven sky areas or areas of a constant density.

    Secondly, I would suggest a prewet, and finally, I would suggest a good stop bath to quickly stop development.

    PE
    Hi PE,

    I could see no uneven areas on a 24" wide version on sheet paper, tray processed. So I've ruled out the neg. That's good I guess because I really like the image. On the other hand, I burned a whole sunny day in the dark troubleshooting my technique so maybe I do wish it was the negative!

    Maybe I should go to stop bath for this. I use TF-4 and a running water stop. Of course the development slows to a stop this way but either way I stop it I don't know why I would get the streaking pattern.

  3. #13
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    I develop color in a Jobo and get streaks. If I add a stop, the streaks vanish. This is a common result of poor stopping and the use of an alkaline fix.

    PE

  4. #14
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    question: is this banding in question HIGHER or LOWER density than your test strips? If higher - I'm thinking that perhaps while the paper's sitting rolled up somewhere it's getting exposure on one side from some unsafe light source that's causing the banding.

    from my own testing and printing I'm getting great super even results with 4 foot x 5 foot prints devving in vertical tanks (5" PVC tube) and scrolling on two sticks (1.25" PVC tube) - except that binding is a problem sometimes with such tight space constraints. But the development is super even using a normal dev dilution for five mins.

    the other nice thing about the vertical thing is that you're automatically safe from fogging (assuming your cylinder is opaque).

  5. #15
    Sparky's Avatar
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    I'm just suggesting that as an alternate method to what you'd normally use... so maybe try something different...?

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkL View Post
    Sparky,

    Yeah, that's how I do it too, raising it up alternately with each hand.

    An 8x10 section of the sky area, exposed on the same emulsion, is fine if processed in a tray so it must be a development problem.

    Mark

  6. #16
    MarkL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparky View Post
    question: is this banding in question HIGHER or LOWER density than your test strips?
    The banding is lower density.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparky View Post
    from my own testing and printing I'm getting great super even results with 4 foot x 5 foot prints devving in vertical tanks (5" PVC tube) and scrolling on two sticks (1.25" PVC tube)
    Vertical in tubes is a good idea! Must take quite a bit of solution. Also tubes would make good holding tanks before final washing.

    BTW, how do you wash those big ones? I'm lucky so far with this 14" wide panoramic image: I can put one at a time in my Versalab 20x24 washer because the partitions are about 2" apart and I can snake it over and between partitions. If I do a 32x40 it'll be into the tub or shower with it I guess.

    Mark
    Last edited by MarkL; 01-21-2008 at 01:18 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  7. #17
    Sparky's Avatar
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    the other great thing about the vertical tubes - is that your chems will keep forever since there is very little surface area. Mine use about 3.5 gal of solution each. It's alot - but not outrageous. And you can get perfectly fitting endcaps at home depot (where I got the tubes).

    I'm not too sure what to make about the lower density thing though. Like Bob said - try to hit it with developer as EVENLY as possible, as quickly as possible. It should make a big difference - even a delay of 10 seconds can cause uneven development (and very easily at that)

  8. #18
    MarkL's Avatar
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    Sparky, so you fasten the print to two 1.25" tubes and roll the print around one, then dip the assembly into the tube and spin from one to the other?

    And how do you wash those mothers? Is it into the shower with your speedo, holding the print?

    I was thinking why am I doing a 32" inch print on mural roll paper when I can do a 24" print on sheet paper? It's a PITA and heck, it's only 8" wider. But it's deceptive because it really is a monster compared to the 24"!

  9. #19

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    I'm not sure what you accomplish with the pvc, the sticks or whatever else people think is necessary for processing large sheets of paper. My guess is that your problem lies in the fact that your technique is giving you irregular agitation. As Mr. Carnie states, the first 15" is crucial to even development. The scrolling technique that we advocate is the simplest and thus fastest way to move the paper through the chemistry. There is no need for a water pre-wash even with the monstrously long prints Bob is making. FB paper rolled emulsion side in already has structural integrity and so your pvc or sticks are completely unnecessary at best and the source of your problem at worse.

    In case you're wondering what I mean by scrolling I will clarify the technique.

    1. After exposure roll the paper up so that it's neither tight nor loose - the roll should be somewhere in the vicinity of three and a half to four and half inches in diameter.

    2. Place the roll of paper in your trough so that the leading edge is towards you. It's important that your chemistry is not too deep as this will make scrolling slow and difficult to control. Really all you need is enough chemistry to wet the leading edge of the roll (and to satisfy the developers capacity with whatever size print you're making).

    3. Quickly pull the leading edge towards you by a few inches and then, gently grasping the roll with one hand run your other hand all the way across the edge insuring that chemistry is now saturating the leading edge of the print's emulsion.

    4. Carefully turn the leading edge over using both hands to form the uptake roll. Now you are ready to scroll.

    5. Now that the paper is in the scroll configuration the area that's being "read" is totally submerged, flat on the bottom of your trough, emulsion side up. With a hand on the uptake roll and the other on the feeder roll you are ready to scroll the print through the chemistry. When you get to the end you're back to step three except you'll be pulling the leading edge away from you to form your uptake roll. With a little practice you'll find that you can move 50-60 inches of paper through your chemistry in less than 15 seconds time. There is a tiny learning curve with the scrolling motion but once mastered it will make all the other techniques seem like recipes for back-aches and crimped prints.

    The scrolling technique also facilitates a good archival wash. I've found that 10 fill and dumps of fresh water after hypo clear with four or five cycles of scrolling per fresh water bath is sufficient for archival processing. Carefully hang the print vertically to dry.

    p.s. get yourself a box of disposable nitrile gloves for this technique.

  10. #20
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    The above method by frotog pretty well sums it up.
    I use a lot of chems, the roll is emulion in , the first 2 scrolls the paper is easy to manipulate, I try to roll evenely each time within a 15 second period, It is extremely critial the first two turns for eveness, as PE points out a good stop is very important. I use 3min 20 seconds for development .
    I work in total darkness as I am using RGB sensitive fibre paper and we have found sticking to the principles is very important. During a printing session we may expose anywhere from 30 to 100 ft of paper and you must replenish your developer, and I have a seperate room for post developing, stop, and first fix.
    We built a 40 ft sink that has extremely large trays that we finish the second fix, hypo clear, wash, toning and then final wash.

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