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  1. #11
    fhovie's Avatar
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    </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Robert @ May 20 2003, 02:23 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (chrisl @ May 19 2003, 07:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Agfa&#39;s Neutol/Plus </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    Neutol is actually the expensive Agfa developer. The MC one is even cheaper and works great with the Agfa paper I use. But you really need to try the stuff to see if you like it. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    I keep looking for reasons not to like the Agfa MC developer (it is really cheap&#33; - so it can&#39;t be good - right?) and still can&#39;t believe how good it is. I still use it mostly for RC prints but it will give you some really good blacks even on fiber paper as well. I have yet to see it go flat - I give up on it before it gives up on me. I know it is at least good for 6 weeks and 40 8x10 per liter and am pretty sure it will keep going even longer. I still play with more expensive brews because they *must* do something better but ... not yet, have I noticed that they work A LOT better.

    Frank
    My photos are always without all that distracting color ...

  2. #12
    Les McLean's Avatar
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    If it is convenient I recommend making your own developers. It&#39;s both cost effective and gives you good control over contrast and print colour. The initial outlay for a stockof raw chemicals and a decent balance is not huge, especially when I see some of the prices being quoted here. I spend about £60 per year on restocking my raw chemicals and I do a lot of printing.

    Of the branded developers available I use Ilford Multigrade, Agfa Neutol Warm, Dektol and Tetenal Centrabrom S which is a soft working developer. I am also a fan of Grade Select a two bath developer made by Fotospeed here in the UK but I know that it is available in most other countries.
    "Digital circuits are made from analogue parts"
    Fourtune Cookie-Brooklyn May 2006

    Website: www.lesmcleanphotography.com

  3. #13

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    </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (fhovie @ May 20 2003, 09:54 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
    I keep looking for reasons not to like the Agfa MC developer (it is really cheap&#33; - so it can&#39;t be good - right?) and still can&#39;t believe how good it is.

    </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    I know what you mean. It&#39;s too cheap to get any respect. Don&#39;t say it too loudly or Agfa will raise the price. I&#39;m just topping up the bottle with fresh solution when the air space gets too big for my tastes.

    Les a person can get away without a scale. I do have a pretty good scale but it&#39;s not that accurate at the low end of things. Instead of creating a scale collection I just got a set of kitchen spoons. It may look funny but a tablespoon of Sodium Sulfite is always the same amount of chemical.

  4. #14
    Les McLean's Avatar
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    </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Robert @ May 20 2003, 06:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Les a person can get away without a scale. I do have a pretty good scale but it&#39;s not that accurate at the low end of things. Instead of creating a scale collection I just got a set of kitchen spoons. It may look funny but a tablespoon of Sodium Sulfite is always the same amount of chemical. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    I agree Robert, consitency is the important thing here and your spoon is giving you just that. I was lucky many years ago when a friend who runs a laboratory for a large multi national gave me two chemical balances that were bound for the waste skip. Before I had those I used an old Post Office brass scale with little weights. I still have it in my darkroom and I consider it an old friend.
    "Digital circuits are made from analogue parts"
    Fourtune Cookie-Brooklyn May 2006

    Website: www.lesmcleanphotography.com

  5. #15

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    Actually, I have a balance scale already I picked up cheap long time ago. So that&#39;s covered. I just find it a bit of an inconvience, but of course I&#39;m being lazy l
    Just so I can shop and cost compare to these over the counter liquid developers, what formula&#39;s would you recommend for cooltone/neutral papers as well as wt papers. I&#39;m just getting into the wt papers and don&#39;t want to go overboard yet with wt develepors like Agfa&#39;s.


  6. #16

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    I think the Agfa MC is supposed to be a neutral developer. I think-))

  7. #17
    Les McLean's Avatar
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    </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (chrisl @ May 20 2003, 08:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Actually, I have a balance scale already I picked up cheap long time ago. So that&#39;s covered. I just find it a bit of an inconvience, but of course I&#39;m being lazy l
    Just so I can shop and cost compare to these over the counter liquid developers, what formula&#39;s would you recommend for cooltone/neutral papers as well as wt papers. I&#39;m just getting into the wt papers and don&#39;t want to go overboard yet with wt develepors like Agfa&#39;s. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    I&#39;ll have a look through my list of home made developers and post a couple of cool formulae. If you want to warm a print up there are several ways that you can do this. With any paper if you add 10 to 15ml of a 10% solution of bromide to the working solution you will warm up the print. If you are using a warm tone paper over exposing and under developing will warm it up. For example, if an exposure is say 20 seconds with a 3 minute development gives you the tonality and contrast you want, try increasing the exposure by up to 40% and reduce development by as much as 50 or even 60%. The print will be considerably warmer and the contrast will be reduced so this a is a good way of dealing with high contrast negatives.

    If you mix a normal developer very dilute. say 1 to 30 instead of 1 to 9 and give extended development you will warm up the print colour. I&#39;ve produced almost red prints using a warm tone paper and this method of development.
    "Digital circuits are made from analogue parts"
    Fourtune Cookie-Brooklyn May 2006

    Website: www.lesmcleanphotography.com

  8. #18

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    That&#39;s real interesting about the large dilution and warm effect. Good to know.
    And thanks Les for posting any formula. When I decide what to do, I&#39;ll order up the ingredients for that, as well as some homemade fix all together.

    Ran out today of Ilford, so in the mean time, I&#39;m going to buy a small jug of Agfa and give it a whirl. Thanks for the earlier suggestions&#33;

  9. #19

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    For most papers Dektol is hard to beat. Lot's of studies have been done and the bottom line is that there is often little to differentiate paper developers. Consider spending your energies on film developers, the area where massive variability exists.
    Regards,
    Bruce

  10. #20
    Ole
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    There are a lot of good developers in "The Darkroom Cookbook". having tried a few of them, I would definitely disagree with the statement that "there is often little to differentiate paper developers". Even with MG IV RC the differences are obvious - at least when comparing otherwise identical prints.

    All great fun - and the ability to mix up a small portion for a special purpose is worth it all to me.

    Maybe too much fun - I've used more different developers in the last 2 months than in the preceding 15 years!
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
    Norway

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