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  1. #31
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    I agree in part, however it's hard to develop an intuitive approach to things when you rely on gadgets. Experience and the lessons taught thru failure are sometimes the best learning tools you can use. What ever works. In the end it really doesn't matter as long as you get there. I realize for some the toys are just as much fun as the end product.
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  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorge Oliveira
    Thanks, dnmilikan.

    That's one point not clear to me:

    I do the exposure series and looking at the negative I obtain my personal EI.
    Now, if I print the test strip and there is no difference in paper between -0.5, base, +0.5 frames it doesn't matter.

    My viewpoint is that I should use as minimum density the one that gives first dark gray above black on a normal grade paper print - not in the negative.

    i can't see what's wrong with this idea.


    Jorge O
    I disagree with the "first dark gray"...because Zone I density will print as black, with no sense of texture. The EI of the film is the speed at which the film exposes. Now one can argue that the film exposes throughout it's spectral sensitivity curve. But in the interest of arriving at meaningful exposures in negatives we need to be assured that we have exposure without having our lowest exposures placed too high on the film's characteristic curve. Why? Because film curves are not truly linear or "straight line". If we place our lowest exposures too high on the curve we will suffer by having our high value densities placed on the shoulder of the curve where the densities are not well differentiated. So what we may gain in enhanced shadow separation will be lost on the other end in the area of highlight separation.

    The usually accepted measure of density indicating exposure is .10 above film base plus fog. This is 1/3 stop. I would not be able, nor do I believe that most people would be able to tell the difference of 1/3 stop exposure on exposed and processed enlarging paper in that area of the film and papers characteristic curve.
    Art is a step from what is obvious and well-known toward what is arcane and concealed.

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  3. #33

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    Ok, here’s what I found.

    I put the gray card up in shade though it is 2pm rather than 6pm as it was yesterday.

    Both my cameras were set manually.

    The Nikkormat lens it a 50mm set at infinity and with an f stop of 2.8 the meter indicates a shutter speed of 60 seconds. ASA set at one dot over 100.

    My Mamiya 120 camera with an 80mm lens set at infinity gives a meter reading of wanting a shutter speed between 60 and 30 seconds. ASA set at 125.

    My Sekonic 508 light meter, set at aperture priority, and dialed to f 2.8, set at INCIDENT, gives an indicated f stop of f 2.89, shutter speed of 30 seconds.

    Sekonic 508 using the reflective spot meter opened all the way up with a dialed in f stop of f 2.8 indicates an f stop of f 2.86 and a shutter speed of 30 seconds.

    So it looks as if my Nikkormat meter will indicate one stop under but in my densitometer tests it appeared that my meter was indicating TWO stops UNDER!

    I’m not sure I have that last paragraph right but still that leaves me with a huge compensation factor as I'd want to go with the densitometer test rather than the one I just did. I don’t know what to say.

  4. #34
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    Are you using zinc batteries for your Nikkormat or the regular ones? If you aren't using zinc your meter could be off as much as 1 stop under exposure as the modern none zinc batteries put out to much voltage. I have the same problem with my Nikkormat.
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  5. #35

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    I called the store where I bought my battery and they wanted to know the number but the little door isn't popping right open and I'm disinclined to put much more force on it. I'll work it some more and see.

  6. #36
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    If you bought it at a regular store then it's one of the new batteries, and probably not a zinc. Basically there are two places you can get zinc batteries. From a camera store (expensive) or from Radio Shack (much cheaper). The RS batteries are for hearing aids but are zinc. The diameter is smaller but I put a couple of turns of masking tape around them and it's just fine. The Nikkormat was designed for 1.35V mercury batteries. The new ones put out 1.5V I believe. The zinc ones put out 1.35V so that is way you want to use them.
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  7. #37

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    I’ve shot with this camera for a couple of years now. The meter on the whole is great. I shot the moon. I shot lots of pictures at night in the city and everything came out incredibly good. I shoot during high sun light. What has always delighted me about the camera is how well it did no matter the conditions.

    But my negatives are thick. Some of that has to do with wrong film development data—I was developing too long—but if I were consistently shooting under by two stops, longer in the developer wouldn’t make that much difference would it?

    When I move my ASA dial down to 32 my meter indicates 15 seconds at f 2.8 just as it should (considering the densitometer test). But that’s an incredible amount of compensation. What if I wanted to shoot film slower than 125?

    I generally print with a 2-3 filter but I have to open my enlarger lens up all the way and then I still have printing times in the 25 to 50 second area.

    I just want a more normal negative but I’m lost now. None of the tests or numbers seem to be instructive as to what I should do.

  8. #38

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    Yeah, the guy at the camera store suggested Radio Shack. But how do you open the little door? Do you just pry it up or is there a catch to release first?

  9. #39

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    Peter, The discrepency of your meters is what I suspected. The meter if it were in agreement with your other meters would indicate that the true EI of this film is 64 (based upon the film density data that you provided). I would replace the battery and see if this brings the meter on the camera into agreement with your other meters. Remember to compare "apples with apples". Reflective and incident metering comparisons are not "apples with apples".

    Once you have the camera meter issues resolved or decide to meter with your Sekonic and manually set your exposures on this camera, I would suggest that you do the development time tests at an EI of 64. Your concerns over negative density will be resolved when this is all in place.
    Art is a step from what is obvious and well-known toward what is arcane and concealed.

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  10. #40
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    If your talking about a Nikkormat there is no door. At least on mine there is a screw in cap on the bottom plate. All you do is use a quarter and unscrew it.
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