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  1. #21

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    You could shoot and develop your negs to suit the contrast of RA paper, then print on Kodak Endura Metallic, which is available in roll sizes from B&H, or is an optional paper at any decent pro lab (as well as some lousy ones, like Costco). If you also want the option of printing your negs on standard b/w paper, which would mean that you would want negs of higher contrast than ones suited for RA papers, then I would expose and develop them to normal contrast for b/w paper, make analog prints for the b/w, and scan to make the metallic prints. Metallic paper is an option with many labs' "direct-to-print" service.
    Last edited by 2F/2F; 05-09-2009 at 11:33 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

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  2. #22
    timbo10ca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2F/2F View Post
    You could shoot and develop your negs to suit the contrast of RA paper, then print on Kodak Endura Metallic, which is available in roll sizes from B&H, or is an optional paper at any decent pro lab (as well as some lousy ones, like Costco). If you also want the option of printing your negs on standard b/w paper, which would mean that you would want negs of higher contrast than ones suited for RA papers, then I would expose and develop them to normal contrast for b/w paper, make analog prints for the b/w, and scan to make the metallic prints. Metallic paper is an option with many labs' "direct-to-print" service.
    So you're confirming to underexpose then overdevelop the negative to fit it onto a grade 2 paper (this is how I'm understanding the "push 2 stops" procedure)? ie underexpose by 2 stops then do N+2 development to bring the negative/paper back to an "N" scenario..... Or just expose normally and rely on the metallic paper for this effect? I don't see how that helps a person with a straight analog workflow (not me, but in this case I want to know how to achieve the technique as it was done before computers or metallic paper was around to rely on). Regarding the suggestion of using metallic paper, I've not seen B&W prints on it, but I have seen color- quite nice for certain scenes. I don't think it applies in this case, as even the sample photos linked here look metallic on my screen and I wouldn't think a scan of metallic paper would translate. Plus, as I stated- I've seen this look achieved by many digital shooters, so I think it must be more in the lighting itself, no????

    Tim
    If only we could pull out our brains and use only our eyes. P. Picasso

    http://www.timbowlesphotography.com

  3. #23

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    I didn't mean to push at at all. Quite the opposite, in fact. I mean that if you are going to print on RA paper, you need to tweak the contrast of your negs to fit the contrast of the paper. You need to make the negs flatter. If you want to print easily on b/w paper as well, I would just expose and develop the negs for b/w paper, and scan if you want to try the metallic paper.

    I suppose I don't know what is meant by a metallic look in this case.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  4. #24
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    SFX / dr5 / ILFOCHROME

    That's an easy question!
    http://www.apug.org/gallery/showphot...7&ppuser=17909

    the sample is in DEV-2 but the DEV-1 SFX film on ILFOCHROME renders a metallic looking image. SFX in dr5 produces a metallic looking chrome.

    regards
    dw



    Quote Originally Posted by PKM-25 View Post
    How does one come by the iridescent / metallic look of an Ilochrome / Cibachrome in a traditional black and white print?

    In a perfect world, this would be a material I could print directly on from a black and white negative.

    Does such an animal exist or am I looking at the dreaded Hybrid?

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by dr5chrome View Post
    That's an easy question!
    http://www.apug.org/gallery/showphot...7&ppuser=17909

    the sample is in DEV-2 but the DEV-1 SFX film on ILFOCHROME renders a metallic looking image. SFX in dr5 produces a metallic looking chrome.

    regards
    dw
    This might be the ticket. And better yet, I can make a "Denver-day" out of it by driving out to your lab in just a few hours.
    "I'm the freak that shoots film. God bless the freaks!" ~ Mainecoonmaniac ~

  6. #26
    keithwms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2F/2F View Post
    I suppose I don't know what is meant by a metallic look in this case.
    Indeed there seem to be two quite different takes on what metallic means! One is literal and apparently has more to do with the print medium; the other is more abstract and has more to do with the rendering of tone in the image. Obviously, I assumed that we were talking about the latter.
    "Only dead fish follow the stream"

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  7. #27

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    A "soothing metallic" look in a black and white print...

    Extend the middle tones. Have very few pure white specular highlights.
    Print down slightly.
    Use at least a 4X5 camera, preferably 5X7 or 8X10.


    Per Volquartz


    http://www.pervolquartz.com

  8. #28
    Andrew Moxom's Avatar
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    Not sure if this is relevant or not, but the most metallic looking images I have seen are by Sandy King. His Carbon transfer prints onto RC paper are just outstanding!... they actually look like etchings and you can actually see the relief in them from an angle quite well. The RC versions especially show a very pronounced metallic look.
    Please check out my website www.amoxomphotography.com and APUG Portfolio .....

  9. #29
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    Sandy, carbon, Sandy, carbon, carbon Sandy.... can somebody please send me a bloody print so I can see what the hooplah is about?!!!

    Or maybe I'll just go down and visit Sandy....
    "Only dead fish follow the stream"

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  10. #30
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    Depends what you mean by metallic - do you mean that the subject itself looks metallic or that the print has that glow to it? For the former case, lighting is key. You want a glossy subject that is specularly-reflecting a large white field, for example I recently found that wet rocks reflecting a cloudy sky look extremely metallic when printed on Ilford RC Pearl.

    You can also buy metallic RA4 paper that has a load of fine silvery metal balls between the paper and the emulsion; I think it's called Kodak Pro Endura Metallic. I've had digital prints (no reason you couldn't do it from a scan) made on it with a lightjet and it works extremely well with subjects that contain a lot of saturated colour but it has poor dynamic range. You will lose a lot of both highlight and shadow detail compared to a normal RA4 paper. When a colourful print on this stuff is directly lit, the print has a beautiful glowing backlit appearance to it.

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