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Thread: D-76 question

  1. #21
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    D76 is a negative developer for cine use, or making optical positives from a negative. The other thread was about its use as the first developer in a Reversal process which requires quite different parameters. D76 is relatively low contrast as a developer which is better suited to negatives rather than reversal.

    Ian

  2. #22
    wogster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    Over the years I've tended to use replenished developers for commercial work, usually processing 10 to 20 rolls of 120 or a dozen or so 5x4's in a session sometimes more. For my personal work I used Rodinal for 35mm through to 5x4 alongside Xtol, I liked Rodinal for it's ability to use dilution rather than just development time for expansion & contraction, N-2 & N-2 particularly, and as I often process away from home a one shot dev is more practiacl in this respect.

    However in real terms comparing negatives and final prints replenished ID-11(D76) or Xtol gives me very much the same final image quality as Rodinal or now Pyrocat HD. My choice is down to economics because with a high number of films using developers like D76, ID-11, Xtol etc dilute to 1+2 which is my preference is just not cost effective, and replenishment gives almost the same qualities while being simple and extremely economic.

    At present my volumes are lower as my commercial work is now rarely film based so the Xtol lies idle and everything gets processed in Pyrocat HD. So yes replenished developers compare very favourably with one-shot if the volume of film is sufficient, and of course deep tanks are ideal for 10x8 & 5x4 work.

    Ian
    To summarize:

    If your shooting low volume one of the long life one shot developers such as Rodinal is better then trying to keep life in a batch of replenished D76/ID11.

    So the question becomes at what point does it become more
    sensible to use a replenished developer, a roll a week, a roll a day, more, less?
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

  3. #23

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    The answer to your question, wogster, is in tech pub J78 from Kodak. Replenishment information starts on page 7 under "Storage Life and Capacity."
    Frank Schifano

  4. #24
    wogster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fschifano View Post
    The answer to your question, wogster, is in tech pub J78 from Kodak. Replenishment information starts on page 7 under "Storage Life and Capacity."
    That's the capacity, what I was looking for is how FEW rolls you can process while it's still economical. For example if you buy a package of developer and mix it up, and run a roll through it, and it's dead before you run another roll, then it's not as economical as a one shot developer like Rodinal where even at a roll a month the concentrate will last long enough that you can use it all up.
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

  5. #25
    cmacd123's Avatar
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    Page 7 and 8 of J78 imply that you can run about 100 rolls per US gallon of developer and replenisher, at which time you are to start over, and they also imply that a month is the shelf life. While it may last longer, for planning purposes you should take your monthly film use and divide the cost of a gallon of developer and replenisher by that number of rolls to get the cost per roll. Then calculate the cost using the developer one shot depending on your tanks. (picking a package size that will most closely match the way you use the stuff.)

  6. #26

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    In other words, do the math and get your answer.
    Frank Schifano

  7. #27
    wogster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fschifano View Post
    In other words, do the math and get your answer.
    Well, Ian said that as he reduced his volume of film use, he found at some point it was cheaper to use a different process, then D76 + D76R, so I was wondering at what point that was. I can do the math and figure it out, but I already know that for my own shooting patterns a one shot concentrated developer will be cheaper. There are others though that might want to know this, especially those lost in the digital wilderness for a while, returning to film use.
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

  8. #28
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Paul, it's not just the cost it's also the storage life if a replenished developer isn't being used sufficiently. I haven't used Deep tanks since the mid 80's so went back to how I'd worked in my youth (at school) using 2.5 litre bottles.

    It's worth noting that Kodaks capacity figures are quite conservative and in practice those numbers would usually be exceeded by quite a long way, without any problems, we were experienced enough to spot when the developer was close to collapse & needed replacing.

    A major bonus of using a replenishment system is there are no chemicals to mix each time you process, so it's load spirals et and away, it's easy to keep or bring the chemistry to the right temperature, so it can cut the overall processing cycle as there's less preparation etc.

    With replenished Xtol I was often processing 20-30 roll, leaving it stored a month or so before the next batches and my working solution lasting over a year with no problems, I would process a single film first to double check the developer was still OK. The only reason I've just stopped using Xtol this way is I'm rarely back in the UK, and it's easier to fly with concentrated developers, plus my Xtol doesn't get used/is stored too long.

    If you process 3 or 4 rolls of film a week or 6-12 sheets of 5x4 or larger then using a replenishment system is definitely worth contemplating.

    Ian

  9. #29

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    Ian,

    How would you go about setting up a tank line? I've been developing my 8x10 film in a Jobo print drum, 2 sheets at a time, and have noticed slight but noticeable uneven development in smooth tonal areas such as sky, cloud etc.

    Tom.

  10. #30
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    The line was already installed when I rented my factory unit back in the late 70's, there was a commercial photographer sub tenant, as we weren't competitors he stayed & we shared film darkroom. The Kodak (UK) tanks were sunk into a bench in the darkroom, a line of 4, Dev stop, fix & wetting agent/final rinse. A 5th tank sat in the sink for washing. Roll films were processed in stainless steel spirals in a basket, sheet film on hangers, agitation was by hand.

    These lines & tanks do come up for sale on Ebay occasionally, but I think I'll make a smaller system at some stage for my 10x8 work, probably using fibre glass, or PVC allowing 4 or 5 sheets to be processed together.

    Ian

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