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Thread: out of date?

  1. #11
    GJA
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    I think that its crazy that on July 31st, the film is perfectly fine, yet on August 1st its not.

    I would happily past date film if it was what I really wanted. I think the bigger mistake would be to buy a cheap film even though you would rather have something else. In my personal opinion it would be much better to buy expired Delta 100 than fresh AristaEDU.

  2. #12
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    "Cheap film" isn't necessarily bad film. Arista.EDU film happens to be Fomapan, and it's actually pretty good film. It's grainier than Ilford, Kodak or Fuji but it has a nice tonality that is different from other films.

    If you wanted to use the logic somewhere else, why do most people use 3-cent teabags to make tea instead of buying $200 per kg first-flush Darjeeling? (I actually do buy Darjeeling because it's delicious, and it's still only about 40-50 cents per cup.) There's good, and then there's good enough. For some people, the cheaper product suits their desires and preferences just fine.

    As far as expiry goes, of course film doesn't go bad the day after it expires, but it gradually deteriorates as it gets closer to its expiry date (and at faster or slower rates depending on how it is stored).

    Another issue is that faster films deteriorate more rapidly than slower ones. This is because cosmic rays eventually fog photographic films, and they are unavoidable unless you store your film kilometres underground. For this reason, expired Pan-F Plus is a much safer bet than expired Delta 3200.

    Incidentally I actually find that the base fog of Delta 3200 and T-Max P3200 is too high for my tastes by the expiry date - I prefer to shoot it as fresh as possible. Some of the best Delta 3200 shots I've ever taken were shot on ultrafresh film.

    Colour film, particularly slide film, is a bigger gamble because there tends to be colour shifts as the film ages. With slide film, you cannot correct this. With colour print film, you can to some degree correct in printing so it's less of an issue.

    Freezing your film (or at least refrigerating it) slows down the degradation, which is why the 2006-expired bulk rolls of 35mm Ilford Pan-F Plus that I bought just as it was expiring are still really good to shoot, but fast films are not going to last as long even if you freeze them.

    I shot some 1978-expired Kodak Vericolor II film a couple of weekends ago and it turned out really well, but it had been frozen since 1977. Still, I'm not shooting important stuff with it. If I had a shoot I had to nail, I'd be using fresh film for sure.
    Jim MacKenzie - Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada

    A bunch of Nikons; Feds, Zorkis and a Kiev; Pentax 67-II (inherited from my deceased father-in-law); Bronica SQ-A; and a nice Shen Hao 4x5 field camera with 3 decent lenses that needs to be taken outside more. Oh, and as of mid-2012, one of those bodies we don't talk about here.

    Favourite film: do I need to pick only one?

  3. #13
    wogster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fotch View Post
    HaHaHaHa

    Well put.
    Maybe it's my old film learnin', but I've always preferred to come home with 5 good photos, then 5,000 crappy ones.
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

  4. #14
    Wade D's Avatar
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    I'm using up a few boxes of Plus-X 4x5 that I found in a box in the garage a while ago. Base fog is acceptable but it has to be shot at ISO 64. It expired in 1989 so 20 years have taken a toll but I'm just using it to mess around and see what I get. If the work was critical I would be using fresh film. I don't think taking shots of the dogs counts as critical.:rolleyes:

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wade D View Post
    I'm using up a few boxes of Plus-X 4x5 that I found in a box in the garage a while ago. Base fog is acceptable but it has to be shot at ISO 64. It expired in 1989 so 20 years have taken a toll but I'm just using it to mess around and see what I get. If the work was critical I would be using fresh film. I don't think taking shots of the dogs counts as critical.:rolleyes:
    The lady down the street with her D700 and kit lens tells me that "yes, pictures of dogs is critical work."

    In general i'll shoot any aged film. But I do pull (I almost always pull in the daylight as well) a stop for each decade.
    Stop worrying about grain, resolution, sharpness, and everything else that doesn't have a damn thing to do with substance.

    http://www.flickr.com/kediwah

  6. #16
    wogster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GJA View Post
    I think that its crazy that on July 31st, the film is perfectly fine, yet on August 1st its not.

    I would happily past date film if it was what I really wanted. I think the bigger mistake would be to buy a cheap film even though you would rather have something else. In my personal opinion it would be much better to buy expired Delta 100 than fresh AristaEDU.
    It's not a 1 day thing, as soon as a roll of film is made, it starts to age, the quality is acceptable up to a certain point, after which it has degraded to the point where the results are sub-optimal. The manufacturer has to pick a specific date, so they do.

    As for cheap film, it depends on who makes it, and how good their quality control is. The big name brands (Kodak, Ilford, and Fuji) have very high standards for quality control, and fairly conservative expiry dates. Some of the other manufacturers have much less stringent quality control and more optimistic expiry dates.

    I think it really depends on what your photographing, if your going on a $10,000 Alaskan Cruise, where most of your photos will be once in a lifetime opportunities, then trying to save $50 on film, is probably not a good idea. Because you can't really re-shoot without buying another cruise :rolleyes:



    If your just goofing around at home taking pictures of the cat then it is much less critical.
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

  7. #17
    David Brown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RalphLambrecht View Post
    Spending hundreds or more on equipment and saving a few bucks on film and chemistry...


    (see sig line)

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by wogster View Post
    In general slower films age slower then fast films, cold stored film, will last longer then film that is stored at warmer temperatures. A dealer like Freestyle, your probably okay, just keep it in the freezer until the day before you want to use it.

    Now for economy here is what I have discovered in more then 30 years of shooting:

    Get really good at 1 or 2 films, say one 100 speed and one 400 speed, use the same chemistries all the time, use a consistent process. Buy good quality film that is not expired, put it in the deep freeze. Keep your camera and darkroom equipment in good repair. Learn how to properly focus and select an exposure so that you don't produce unusable negatives. Buy good quality paper that keep that in the freezer as well, and use the same chemistries and process. Use a scanner or contact sheet so you don't waste time printing negatives that you don't want to print right now.

    How to waste more money then the military:

    Buy different films all the time, and lots of expired stuff, experiment with the developer de jour, go cheap when it comes to equipment maintenance, let the camera select focus and exposure, and print everything on cheap oft expired paper, using the process of the week. You end up producing a lot of crappy prints and redoing a lot of work all the time. You end up machine gun shooting a lot of the time, and most of it is garbage.
    excellent advice!!!
    Regards

    Ralph W. Lambrecht
    www.darkroomagic.comrorrlambrec@ymail.com[/URL]
    www.waybeyondmonochrome.com

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by GJA View Post
    I think that its crazy that on July 31st, the film is perfectly fine, yet on August 1st its not.
    I'm not sure about film, but I can tell you from experience, the logic works with airport sandwiches!
    Regards

    Ralph W. Lambrecht
    www.darkroomagic.comrorrlambrec@ymail.com[/URL]
    www.waybeyondmonochrome.com

  10. #20

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    mmmmm... airport sandwiches...

    anyway, i'm certainly not taking any super expensive alaskan cruises anytime soon, i can barely afford the expired film

    since i'm just getting back into film i'm really just trying to get the hang of it while spending the least amount of money possible. but like i said before, i'm pretty much set on using fp4+ and DD-X for a while, and not jumping around to whatever film and developer is on special.
    -Jake

    Photography by the seat of my pants.

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