Kodak Xtol - questions & thoughts vs ID11

[Sim2]

Hi there,

Yep, this is going to be another of those "what do you think threads?" that will no doubt include the "why not try it for yourself and see" response, however i will still plough ahead.

I currently shot primarily FP4 dev'd in stock ID11 oneshot and have had some success with HP5 and Adox CHS with the same dev. I intend to keep with the same film choices but am considering switching to using Xtol (or at least giving it a fair crack over the winter).

I have read some about this dev and it *seems* to be finer grained, with shadow detail at box speed than D76 or ID11 (don't know how true this is). I am thinking of using Xtol as a reusable stock solution, with replenishment of around 75/100ml per film rather than as a one-shot dev.

I have read that that as a stock solution, it *beds down* after processing a couple of rolls - is this true? What is the change between fresh and *bedded down*? I have seen times of 5 mins for ID11 at 20C - this seems short and worries me slightly, I like longer times as minor variations have less of an effect over a longer time than a short time, thoughts on times with Xtol?

Can Xtol die really quickly with no warning, even a stock solution?

Open ended bit here - any thoughts on using Xtol with FP4, HP5 or Adox CHS? Good bits, bad bits - bring it on..........

Thanks for your time,
Sim2.

[topoxforddoc]

Sim2,

I've now migrated to XTOL, having tried most devs over the last 20 years. I think it's as good as DD-X, but much cheaper. At £5.49 for 5L, it ain't expensive. It pushes films really well; I regularly push HP5 to 1600 with minimal grain (albeit with increased contrast). Personally I use it at 1:1 as a one shot dev. I can't see why you'd want to replenish unless you're in a commercial lab with tanks.
I hope that helps.

Best wishes,

Charlie
www.charlie-chan.co.uk

[Sirius Glass]

Can Xtol die really quickly with no warning, even a stock solution?

Old news. The problem was taken care of years ago. It is not a problem.

Steve

[vedmak]

Xtol is a nice one, but as it has been said many times before, you need to work with your film/developer combo to get good results, here is the link to how to use it from Kodak:http://www.kodak.com/global/en/profe.../j109/j109.pdf

just the facts, no hearsay, if you follow their directions to the letter and mix entire gallon bag at a time, you will not have a problem with sudden death of the stock solution.

[Sim2]

Old news. The problem was taken care of years ago. It is not a problem.

Steve

Thanks for this, was one of the "nuggets" of info I read whilst trawling the archives here. That, I think can be one of the issues with web based info - once posted it is there as truth, even if an "issue" has been improved on. Thanks.

[Sim2]

Sim2,

Personally I use it at 1:1 as a one shot dev. I can't see why you'd want to replenish unless you're in a commercial lab with tanks.

www.charlie-chan.co.uk

Using it diluted at 1:1 or as one-shot stock was my first thoughts, as this replicates what I do currently with ID11, though when I read about replenishment usage I was quite taken with the idea of a "magic never-ending" pot of working dev!

I was thinking about 1 litre (which is the most I use in one session) as my stock and replenishing from the other 4 litres (from a 5L pack).

It is cheap enough to go one-shot but just musing about possibilities.

[Brandon D.]

Old news. The problem was taken care of years ago. It is not a problem.

Steve

Seconded!!!

[markbarendt]

Xtol is very, very reliable, it's also great for replenishing.

[Exeter2010]

Xtol has always been my go-to developer and any time I'm not sure about a film, or under or overrate I use Xtol because for me it's quite predictable. I shoot primarily FP4+ in LF and MF and Arist Premium 400 for 35mm. I have used Xtol for all and I have never had a badly developed roll (related to the dev itself) with any film. Very versatile. I mix it 1:1 into 5 1L bottles and get probably 8-10 rolls of 135 film, 12 4x5 sheets, equivalent 120, etc. During that period I do not replenish or change anything, don't extend time either. It is very possible that I don't have a good enough eye to tell if there's any diff in the negs, but I haven't seen anything change wit this routine. I simply do not recall what Ilford says about how many rolls per liter. I might be throwing it out at 50%, I'll have to read it again. Last thing, it lasts for literally 6 months at 1:1 in a tightly closed full bottle. I know because I've done it, several times.

So all that was a mouthful of ancedotal evidence, but I'll vote for Xtol any day with any film I have ever used - which ain't many.

Good Luck!

[tkamiya]

I *think*, the sudden death problem has been resolved. My personal experience is in full bottle with no air, the working solution lasted anywhere between 8 to 11 months. At 8 months, it was OK. At 11 months, it was very inconsistent so I threw it out. After the 6 months period where Kodak says it'll last, I was doing cilp test before using the solution just to be sure.

To me, XTOL has been finicky. It seem to be hyper active where even with very careful control of agitation and temperature, it would develop extreme contrast. At -15% development time, it seems to work ok for me most of the time. I've started using D-76 and I've been happier.

I've been communicating with a lot of people here on APUG about XTOL. It seems some people swear by it and some just can't get it to do what they want. I've been told, it should work just as well as any other developers, but my personal experience tells me otherwise. I had very senior/experienced person here tell me, he gets very thin negs for no apparent reasons. (sorry, this is a hear-say)

You'll just have to try it and see if you like it. It may work well for you, or not.