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  1. #11

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    You must beware of over exposure with EFKE films that causes increased grain and loss of sharpness. These a re single layer emulsions and have a bit less tolerance to under or over exposure.
    Yes, a very correct statement for Efke/Adox CHS.

    But Rodinal is not a real fine grain developer. But high acutance developers are fitting very good with Efke 25-50-100 films. Like Tetenal neofin Blau/Blue, Beutler A+B or FX-1.

    So if you want less grain: Try the Efke 25 in one of those developers.
    And when using Rodinal, go to less agitation because then Rodinal will generate much less grain too.

    Here an example of Efke 25 in Beutler A+B, 1+1+10 for 7:00 minutes, 20C in 35mm format.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    My favorite store: http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl

  2. #12

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    Amaloco AM-74 and shaking it around for 3-5min in water somewhere between 20-40C
    AM-74 is a concept Hydroquinone, Phenidone developer were sharpness is over fine grain. It's a semi-compensating developer which has to be used around 20C too. A lot of films are going around 5:00 - 6:00 minutes in AM74 1+7. However by diluting more, the sharpness will also go up with a minimum of more grain.

    AM-74 is in 1+9 - 1+15 on it's best. With a lot of films you can have good results with it.

    Greetz,

    Роберт
    My favorite store: http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl

  3. #13

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    If you want fine grain then use a slow film such as Ilford Pan F Plus and a fine grain developer such as Perceptol or Kodak D-23.
    A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral.

    ~Antoine de Saint-Exupery

  4. #14

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    Tetenal Neofin Blue was the developer designed for the original Adox films, some say current ones are a bit different but the result is still the best.

  5. #15
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    Fine grain usually starts with a fine-grained film. It is the most important factor by far IME. The Adox/Efke 25 and 50 films have pretty fine grain, but not when compared to a modern film like T-Max. And the Adox/Efke 100 is not very fine grained at all IME.

    I'd start with HC-110 for it's convenience and relatively fine grain. It has a decent amount of grain solvent if used at dilution B or stronger. Rodinal does not.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

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  6. #16
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    Thanks a lot for all the replies, it starts making sense now and what I was doing wrong or what I've should have done different. It's all more complex then it first looks, but that is what I like about analog photography and developing, all the variables.

  7. #17

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    If you want real fine grain in 35mm you can develop with an Ultra Fine Grain type developer.

    Actual still in commercial availability:
    Perceptol
    CG-512/RLS
    W665

    But they have all the disadvantage that you will loose at least one F stop and the sharpness will be less. In theory the Ultra Fine Grain developers based on Phenylene Diamine will have the smallest grain. W665 (Windisch) is based on Ortho Phenylene Diamine.
    This developer works very well on e.g. Fomapan T200 film (E.I. 80-100).
    My favorite store: http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl

  8. #18
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    Rodinal does not like A) high temperature and B) overdevelopment. I use Rodinal at 16 deg Celsius which requires to increase the dev time by a factor 1.6.
    It is a good idea not to try receiving the box speed of the film because that leads mostly to overdevelopment.
    With that in mind you can get a quite fine grain from Rodinal. Other devs can give slightly finder grain, but the grain itself is muddy.
    ---
    Uwe Pilz

  9. #19
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by piu58 View Post
    Rodinal does not like A) high temperature and B) overdevelopment. I use Rodinal at 16 deg Celsius which requires to increase the dev time by a factor 1.6.
    It is a good idea not to try receiving the box speed of the film because that leads mostly to overdevelopment.
    With that in mind you can get a quite fine grain from Rodinal. Other devs can give slightly finder grain, but the grain itself is muddy.
    That's the misconception about Rodinal it's not the temperature of the deveoper itself that causes any problems it's poor temperature control throughout the entire process cycle including the washing.

    By working at a lower temperature you're reducing the swelling & softening of the emulsion slightly but it's entirely unecessary if you just monitor all stages of the processing and keep temperatures within +/- 1? C of the initial developer temperature.

    I used Rodinal as one of my two main film developers for about 20 years and working at the recommended 20? C was never an issue.

    Ian

  10. #20

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    I am using this para- Amino Phenol type developer since 1967 and control the temperature always between 18C - 20C. Equal processing temperatures during all steps were in the past very important and still is for classical type films like Efke. By reducing the agitation you can reach reasonable fine grain with Rodinal.

    But for extreme grain reduction you need an Ultra Fine Grain developer based on Phenylene Diamine (Sease III, Windisch W665, MCM100). But you will loose at least one F stop with Ultra Fine Grain developers and not all type films will react in the right way.

    Regards,

    Роберт
    My favorite store: http://www.fotohuisrovo.nl

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