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  1. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I think that I answered that in my post. QC in the "Kodak" plant in China was not up to Kodak standards AFAIK.

    PE
    That was a long time ago PE. No place on earth changes as fast or as much as China. When I first arrived in Shanghai in 2006, there were TWO subway lines under the city. Today, there are 14 and more are under construction.

    Whatever film situation existed when Kodak pulled out of China, you can bet ever last dollar that today, that situation is totally unrecognizable to those who knew the previous time.

  2. #52
    MattKing's Avatar
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    I don't think that a reduction in manufacturing costs will make much of a difference.

    Quality control, environmental control and distribution costs are the problems.

    Kodak can make film really cheaply - in quantity!

    But the costs of distribution and wastage when the film doesn't sell fast enough are what is killing us.
    Matt

    “Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”

    Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2

  3. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattKing View Post
    I don't think that a reduction in manufacturing costs will make much of a difference.

    Quality control, environmental control and distribution costs are the problems.

    Kodak can make film really cheaply - in quantity!

    But the costs of distribution and wastage when the film doesn't sell fast enough are what is killing us.
    From what I read here, Kodak has waaaay too much production capacity. That means costs are HIGH, not cheap. Kodak cannot downsize their production so they are stuck with enormous costs and so their film is far too expensive to produce.

  4. #54
    zsas's Avatar
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    Why some no name Chinese manufacturer when ADOX already meets the criteria, below per their website:

    ADOX Fotowerke GmbH Bad Saarow carries on the tradition of the ADOX brand.

    We manufacture fibre base papers, 35mm films, rollfilms, sheetfilms, Super 8 moovie films, photochemistry and more.

    Our goal is to keep a full range of photochemical products in a small scale manufacturing process allive.
    In 2009 we opened up the "worlds smallest photochemical factory" in Bad Saarow.

    ADOX Fotowerke GmbH is working under low automatisation with a large degreee of manual work.
    This enables us to be very flexible and manufacture many different types of films and papers without much overhead and fixed costs.
    Our workflow today is not far away form the original ADOX Dr. C. Schleussner Fotowerke which also used similar machines in their times, but we are now much smaller.

    Even after the "digital revolution" ADOX still stands strong for a comprehensive range of classic photographic products.

    This is one of the telling comments from Mirko at ADOX:

    Quote Originally Posted by ADOX Fotoimpex View Post
    Our small factory can make quantities of a few thousand rolls of film at about 3-5 USD per roll.
    Per
    http://www.apug.org/forums/forum390/...to-news-4.html

    I just don't see film being saved by Chinese firms when we already have so many in the game (Ilford, Efke, ADOX, Rollei, Foma, Lomo, Kodak (tbd), Lucky, Shanghai, etc, etc...). Think the forest through the trees is happening....there are many others, why the theory that say Lucky/Shanghai will be the new Kodak? I don't think we as film users have much connection with them and that is the magic varriable, a unknown entity has a high barrier to mass success unless it has something to offer the others dont, I am just not seeing it.

    Last, I think Rollei just brought out a new color film....
    Andy

  5. #55
    Steve Smith's Avatar
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    It doesn't really matter where it is made. The deciding factor is the number of people who want to buy it.


    Steve.
    "People who say things won't work are a dime a dozen. People who figure out how to make things work are worth a fortune" - Dave Rat.

  6. #56
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RattyMouse View Post
    That was a long time ago PE. No place on earth changes as fast or as much as China. When I first arrived in Shanghai in 2006, there were TWO subway lines under the city. Today, there are 14 and more are under construction.

    Whatever film situation existed when Kodak pulled out of China, you can bet ever last dollar that today, that situation is totally unrecognizable to those who knew the previous time.
    I agree, but have they applied those skills to film manufacturing. That is the question.

    I ask here for anyone to comment on their experience with Chinese film, bad or good. So far I have read quite a few bad comments on Chinese films. So, lets hear the comments!

    PE

  7. #57
    Mainecoonmaniac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DREW WILEY View Post
    Ha! I just saw your little rewrite of history, Mr MaineCooncat, presumably a conoisseur of kitties the size of Pleistocene ground sloth species.
    How did you know that I'm a connoisseur of kitties?

    I did say it wasn't verifiable history Anyway, I think you're correct. It's probably faster and cheaper for home C-41 processing.

    I do have to say that you can't make Chinese food at home as well as your local take out joint.

  8. #58
    CGW
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I agree, but have they applied those skills to film manufacturing. That is the question.

    I ask here for anyone to comment on their experience with Chinese film, bad or good. So far I have read quite a few bad comments on Chinese films. So, lets hear the comments!

    PE
    Serious jamming issues with Lucky 120 b&w, especially in Mamiya RB67 backs, less so in Mamiya 645 and Bronica SQ backs. Image quality was OK when I could actually get a roll through a camera.

  9. #59
    Mainecoonmaniac's Avatar
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    I remember when Arista EDU (Foma) film had a curling problem. Now it's no longer an issue. I'm sure Chinese film is not quite up to snuff to Kodak nor Ilford, but give them some time.

  10. #60

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    Gosh - do you folks in Maine know what Chinese food is? "Take out" ??? Yecch. Even that bully of
    a horse-sized Cooncat in my backyard wouldn't eat that. (The other cats gang up on him and make
    him eat alone anyway - poor outcast!) ...



 

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