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  1. #1
    cinejerk's Avatar
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    Anyone have a source for Ethylenediamine?

    I guess the title is somewhat self explanatory.

    I talked to artkraft. He can get it but the hazmat fees are double the actual cost of the product.

    Anyone know of a current supplier without the ridiculous fees?

  2. #2

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    Ethylenediamine is a dangerous chemical and any supplier is going to charge a hazmat fee, You don't say what you need it for so a suubstitute cannot be recommended.
    A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral.

    ~Antoine de Saint-Exupery

  3. #3
    cinejerk's Avatar
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    Ethylenediamine essential E6 chemical

    Hi Gerald

    Ethylenediamine is an essential chemical in E6 color developer. According to PE, you don't have a true

    E6 color developer unless this chemical is included.

    I too would like to know what this chemical does and would like to find a substitute.

    But I can't argue with PE so I am trying to find a source that isn't going to cost me $$$.

    Thanks for your reply.

  4. #4

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    There are two things that you can do if it is hard to obtain this chemical The first would be to find a substitute formula which does not use it. As PE says some formulas are better than others. So there would be some research on your part. The second approach would be to use ethylenediamine monohydrochloride or the dihydrochloride and increasing the amount of alkali in the formula. You would be creating ethylenediamine in situ in this case. Both these chemicals are safer to handle and shpuld not have a hazmat fee since they are solids.
    A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral.

    ~Antoine de Saint-Exupery

  5. #5
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    There are excellent E6 formulae that don't use Ethylene diamine as such however they do use an EDTA salt isntead.

    Ian

  6. #6
    cinejerk's Avatar
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    Ian
    Can you post a formula here? Which EDTA salt do they use?

  7. #7
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    Some formulas with Ethylene Diamine use the Sulfate salt. It is better than the HCl salt. See posted Kodak formulas for VNF film processing which are on the Kodak web site. They list some sources of the chemical. It is supplied as a 90% liquid or a solid H2SO4 salt.

    There are no fomulas using chelating agents like EDTA, but if there are some free amines that are less volatile, they may work.

    The Ethylene Diamine acts as a mild solvent and fogging agent for the silver, to induce better development of the grains and giving higher dmax.

    PE

  8. #8
    cinejerk's Avatar
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    Thanks again PE

    The kodak vnf-1 formula for color developer shows ethylenediamine 98% 3 grams. I think that this is a little odd to
    list the quantity of a liquid in grams.

    So if I found ethylenediamine sulfate that would be a reasonable substitute? 3 grams of this solid?

  9. #9
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Cinejerk, you need to do your own research, there are a few E6 formulæ that use EDTA salts in the colour developerand they work perfectly. They have been posted on APUG. There were highly reputable professional labs who made up all their colour chemistry from scratch using these formulae.

    Ian

  10. #10
    cinejerk's Avatar
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    Ok thanks Ian. I just thought that if I could get as close to the kodak formula it would be best.

    I was just notified by my supplier that any chemical liquid or solid with the word "amine" in it would 99% of the time be classed as a "hazmat".

    So I guess I'm screwed !!!

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