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  1. #21
    holmburgers's Avatar
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    Thanks guys,

    Ron, I can't wait to pick Mark's brain on this topic; had no idea there were 2 dye sets!

    Well, I guess you could say something fishy was going on...

  2. #22
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Solantine Pink and Chicago Blue are two dyes that come close to being a usable pair. You need the right filters to match the dye set to expose the film. These would be at about 450 - 500 nm and 600 - 650 nm for starters.

    PE

  3. #23
    holmburgers's Avatar
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    Hey Elvis,

    Yep, like you discovered, those toners won't do the trick. You need to actually replace the silver with dye somehow, so that the dye is in proportion to the silver. Highlights should be clear (just as they would be with silver) and shadows full of dye.

    You're also right about needing 2 separate light sources if you're going to use filters to create the color; this is heading into additive country. You could do this too, and just use silver negatives with appropriate filters to view each through. The trick here is that you'll need to combine them for viewing somehow. This is analogous to the Kromskop.

    You could try dye mordanting with basic dyes (something like this, pg. 755), or making a gelatin relief image and using acid dyes, like dye-imbibition.

    Basic dyes have no affinity for gelatin, hence they need a mordant which can be made via the silver, whereas acid dyes generally are attracted to gelatin and so all you need is a gelatin relief image (think carbon method, or you could try a dichromate bleach). Realistically I think those are the two best paths.

  4. #24
    kb3lms's Avatar
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    You need to actually replace the silver with dye somehow, so that the dye is in proportion to the silver. Highlights should be clear (just as they would be with silver) and shadows full of dye.
    To do this, aren't you talking about something like kodachrome (as in modern) couplers?
    All this has happened before, and all this will happen again.

  5. #25
    holmburgers's Avatar
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    No, there are easier ways to do it.

  6. #26
    Steve Smith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DREW WILEY View Post
    Hollywood also had its early flirtation with two-color photography
    I found this a while ago: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NObu5...endscreen&NR=1

    I think it is a two colour movie film process. Gasparcolor.


    Steve.
    Last edited by Steve Smith; 05-17-2012 at 02:41 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    "People who say things won't work are a dime a dozen. People who figure out how to make things work are worth a fortune" - Dave Rat.

  7. #27
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Gasparcolor was 3 color and used dye bleach.

    PE

  8. #28
    holmburgers's Avatar
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    Steve, thanks for posting that, it looks really great! PE's right though; it's 3-color dye-bleach system, a precursor to Cibachrome, developed by Hungarian Bela Gaspar. A very interesting process, but only useful for printing color from separations, not capturing color directly from the scene (IIRC). It was widely used for animation also.

  9. #29
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    Coming in here a bit late, I'm pretty much thinking out loud, and it's probably a stupid question, but would it be possible to use C-41 or E-6 type couplers, in solution with one of the CD's, as a second developer on standard, reverse exposed B/W film? Or do those families of couplers have to be adsorbed to the silver halide crystals to work? (So what I'm envisioning is sort of a split K-xx process, where the couplers and developer are in the same solution, using two -- or three -- separately exposed standard b/w films, which would then be sandwiched.)

    I think PE has said you could do this with the Kodachrome couplers, but since those aren't readily available, that's not a viable solution.

    Ed
    "I only wanted Uncle Vern standing by his new car (a Hudson) on a clear day. I got him and the car. I also got a bit of Aunt Mary's laundry, and Beau Jack, the dog, peeing on a fence, and a row of potted tuberous begonias on the porch and 78 trees and a million pebbles in the driveway and more. It's a generous medium, photography." -- Lee Friedlander

  10. #30
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Yes, I've done this for well over over 30 years for colouring B&W prints, I use raw couplers but Tetenal made a dye coupler kit, not sure if it's still available. Jave alsom used colour couplers with B&W films.

    Ian



 

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