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  1. #31
    Diapositivo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof_Pixel View Post
    >> Maybe if I have time I will find some more scientifically exposed theories.

    Like, 'The world is really flat' - after all, just look at a map - it's flat?
    How do you dare insulting me, you idiot?
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  2. #32

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    Sorry, but in my book, saying the Apolo moon landings never happened is in the same category as saying the world is flat.

  3. #33
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    Mystery 70mm film from NASA - help

    Ok guys let's agree to disagree, this forum and board is for film, not conspiracy theory, if you want to discuss that further please PM each other, or start a separate post discussing the legitimacy of film in history, I don't want a flame war over this and I'd like to stay on topic as "engineer" has. Thanks.


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  4. #34
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Gentlemen;

    I can comment though. I was there. I saw the Saturn I liftoff and also met six of the first 7 astronauts. I saw Glenn go and met him and Grissom and others. So, there is no problem in my mind. I even talked once to Werner Von Braun. Saying that this event did not take place is denying a factual part of history for some odd purpose.

    PE

  5. #35
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    Mystery 70mm film from NASA - help

    Thanks PE!

    Also, have any suggestions for where I might find the full list of chemicals for the aforementioned films? Since you can't recall the whole thing? Though it certainly was helpful, I have another post that explains why here...

    http://www.apug.org/forums/forum40/111431-1950s-film-agfacolor-ultra-k-40-asa-fomachrome-orwo-color-kodacolor-x.html


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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Gentlemen;

    I can comment though. I was there. I saw the Saturn I liftoff and also met six of the first 7 astronauts. I saw Glenn go and met him and Grissom and others. So, there is no problem in my mind. I even talked once to Werner Von Braun. Saying that this event did not take place is denying a factual part of history for some odd purpose.

    PE
    Sorry for prolonging the OT but I think something I should add.

    PE, what you call "cospirationists" do not "deny" what you call a "fact".
    They point out very strange sequence of coincidence that raise doubts. NASA never answered those doubts.

    They chose the silence. Actually they charged a person, a scientist, to write a work for the clarification of all points, a multi-year project it seems, and then withdrew support and financing to the project with the explanation that explaining things would just give more attention to the doubts.

    If you have, as you have, a scientific cultural background that should ring some bells. Or should at least prove once more that there is a lot of propaganda in all this (probably on both sides) and not so much logic. NASA seems more interested in preserving the status quo with a majority of people convinced they went to the moon than trying to dispel all the serious and motivated doubts of the vocal minority. That would work in politics but not in science.

    The most disturbing things that lead me to a healthy doubt as I repeat are:

    - NASA by mistake destroyed the original TV tape;
    - NASA by mistake destroyed the telemetry data;
    - NASA themselves recently cancelled the new man on moon mission citing excessive radiation risks for crews.
    - Certain pictures of the moon mission clearly appear as if they are tampered with.

    There are a host of other "minor" elements of doubt that anybody can read about.
    That said, will this lead me or other sceptical to bet their balls that man never went on the moon? No sir! But I would advice you not to bet yours

    The case might be that TV tapes and flight data were destroyed due to extreme disorganization, that the new mission on the moon was cancelled to save money but they couldn't say "sorry the government changed his mind we have no (or not enough) money to go back to the moon", that the astronauts actually went on the moon instead of just orbiting somewhere but had no pictures to show so NASA showed the fake ones, etc. But all this does stink.

    The second lunar mission IIRC came back without images. If the same problems had occurred during the first mission, would NASA have said "we went to the moon but have no images to show"? (put it back in the context of the politically charged space race).

    All this does not prevent me from noticing that the presented pictures pose a lot of questions.

    What I say is that this water is not clean and I am not thirsty enough to drink it as it is.

    When China goes to the moon and brings back some definitive proof of Apollo project presence I will be very glad to dispel my doubts! At the moment, I am not a believer. A "sceptic" is somebody who is "dubious" about something that other people judge "certain". Not somebody who is certain of the contrary!

    What outrages some people is that some other people does not have the same certitudes! It's like a religion! (talking about religion, why Aldrin and others always refuse to just swear on the bible that they went to the moon? The president of the US swears on the bible when he takes office. You must swear on the bible, I think, when you witness in a trial. Nothing that make people lose their face. Why not just say: "I swear I did it?" I would swear "no problem" if I did it).

    The truth can be in some grey middle. For instance the US might have fabricated the proof about Apollo 11 but might have managed to go to the moon with, say, the last Apollo mission. It's not just black or white.

    It's a bit like Pearl Harbour. People repeat the story of the "surprise attack". Careful and patient "cospirationist" work by serious historians demonstrated that the US knew the secret codes of the Japanese, decrypted them, knew exactly about the attack, and "chose to be surprised". This does not intend to negate that the Japanese ever made a surprise attack on Pearl Harbour!

    It is important to critically examine history without stopping at the received propaganda.
    Last edited by Diapositivo; 10-24-2012 at 06:46 AM. Click to view previous post history.
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  7. #37
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    Mystery 70mm film from NASA - help

    Diopositivo, I've kindly asked that if you want to continue, that you PM the person or create a new topic, this isn't hard to do, please stop spamming my page with info that is off topic. Thanks.


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  8. #38
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Stone;

    For C-22 you will need:

    Developer:
    CD-3
    Hydroxylamine Sulfate
    Sodium Carbonate
    Potassium Iodide
    Sodium Bromide
    Benzyl Alcohol

    Hardening Stop
    Acetic Acid
    Sodium Acetate
    Potassium Alum

    Bleach:
    Potassium Ferricyanide
    Sodium Bromide
    Kodalk

    Fix:
    Sodium Thiosulfate
    Sodium Sulfite
    Borax

    Stabilizer:
    Photo Flo
    Formaldehyde 37%

    The list for Agfa Color is quite similar but they did not use Benzyl Alcohol and did use a different developing agent.

    PE

  9. #39
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    Mystery 70mm film from NASA - help

    OMG thank you PE this is extensive and AWESOME!!!

    I should make large batches and sell it on eBay at an exorbitant price


    ~Stone

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  10. #40
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    I'll try to find the exact formulas if I have them here. I know that they are in the patent.

    PE

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