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  1. #41
    polyglot's Avatar
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    C41 is the chromogenic negative film process, RA4 is the chromogenic negative paper process. They are a matched pair, i.e. RA4 paper is designed to print C41 negatives.

    Obviously that means you need two sets of chemistry. RA4 gear (paper, chems) is really cheap though and the chemistry lasts extremely well.

    And no, you don't get contrast control unless you want to change the developer chemistry (add sulfite) or use partial bleaching (google for SLIMT). You used to be able to buy several fixed-grade papers with differing contrasts (eg Kodak sold their Endura range in Portra, Supra and Ultra grades) but now you can basically only buy high-contrast paper. It's annoying if you want lower contrast.

  2. #42
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    Okay. I got my Rollei kit from freestyle.

    I was going to go develop my first roll of color but then I got a bit confused. Okay, in b&w I prepared my working solution and kept it in gallon/.5 gallon plastic bottles. Reading the instructions that came with it I'm figuring that you prepare what you're going to use? You don't pre-prepare anything? Is that right? I'm using the 8 oz metal tanks. These equal approximately 250 ml in capacity. If I mix, for example, my developer according to the instructions, I am using half the bottles' contents to get a 250 ml working solution. So, let's say, I use it once, do I dump that after use or do I save it? It doesn't say. If I save it, how many more times do I get to use it? That appears to be the same for all the other solutions. Do I reuse these solutions and if so for how many times? The bleacher, the fixer, the stabilizer, the developer? Are these reusable? As in B&W do I pre mix these solutions in separate containers before or do I do it when I am about to use it? A bit confusing and there's not enough info. I hope someone here can help. Thanks.
    --Mario

  3. #43
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    You can mix it in small batches using a portion of each part of the solution in question such as Developer, Bleach, Fix or Stab/Final Rinse.

    You can use each solution one time and dump or you can use them several times by increasing the development times according to the chart on the Kodak web site. (This is a good exercise for the student! )

    I suggest that you use a 1 - 2% Acetic Acid stop after the development step for uniformity, and I suggest a prewet.

    Have fun.

    PE

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    You can mix it in small batches using a portion of each part of the solution in question such as Developer, Bleach, Fix or Stab/Final Rinse.

    You can use each solution one time and dump or you can use them several times by increasing the development times according to the chart on the Kodak web site. (This is a good exercise for the student! )

    I suggest that you use a 1 - 2% Acetic Acid stop after the development step for uniformity, and I suggest a prewet.

    Have fun.

    PE
    PE, thanks. Ok, freestyle advertises this as a 10-roll kit, but if I do one of your suggestions, to use it only once, this is a 2-roll kit!! Their instructions don't say anything about increasing developing times when reusing.

    I thought I was done buying my chemicals, but it looks like I need this acetic acid. I'll see if I can get it locally. If not, where can I get it and does it come under any other names?

    Thanks.
    --Mario

  5. #45
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    C-41 processing for neophytes

    Quote Originally Posted by macandal View Post
    PE, thanks. Ok, freestyle advertises this as a 10-roll kit, but if I do one of your suggestions, to use it only once, this is a 2-roll kit!! Their instructions don't say anything about increasing developing times when reusing.

    I thought I was done buying my chemicals, but it looks like I need this acetic acid. I'll see if I can get it locally. If not, where can I get it and does it come under any other names?

    Thanks.
    Did you get the Arista kit? That has instructions for re-use *goes to basement grumbling something about stairs and cold*

    You're right. My JOBO press kit for C-41 doesn't give a calculation either... But my E-6 kit says to increase developing times by 4% (multiply your dev time by 1.04 exponentially each time) so I would assume its very similar in C-41.

    PE?

    Personally I find it very difficult to measure out the C-41 kits into smaller batches than they are intended, (as in my kit makes a 1 liter bottle of developer and I wouldn't try to separate out smaller batches as its all powder.

    The E-61 liquid kits I might, but again once you break the deal, air gets into even the un-mixed concentrate and degrades it.

    I've found it's better to just keep exposed rolls in my fridge until I get enough to process out the whole chemistry and do it at once. Otherwise time factors come into play, I ended up destroying an otherwise good roll because I let my E-6 kit sit for a month before using it after mixing.

    I just don't shoot enough film for this to make sense, hence why after I kill this JOBO kit, I'm going all B&W ... color chemistry is just too expensive... And doesn't keep long enough for a home user... Or they don't sell it in small bottles for home users, I would gladly spend $100 if they sent me like 10 portions of sealed developer I could then break the seal one at a time and keep the chemistry for a year and only develop 2 rolls at a time and he happy, but they aren't smart enough to do that...


    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  6. #46
    bvy
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    I have the same Rollei kit from Freestyle. I mix all the chemicals at once. This gives you 500ml of developer which should be good for about ten rolls without having to increase development time (I'm on my 16th roll, but everything past ten is "noncritical" for me). I store the developer in a 500ml PET bottle, squeeze out the air, and keep it refrigerated between sessions. I do not prewet; my understanding was that this dilutes the developer slightly with each development. In that case, maybe increasing development time with each roll does become necessary. The trade-off is that you lose developer; after about five rolls you no longer have enough developer to do 120 in a Paterson tank.

    I also go straight to bleach after developing (I'm curious now about PE's stop bath). I do add a rinse after the bleach and fix, which the instructions don't mention.

  7. #47
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    Geez guys, just go to the Kodak web site and find it! You can do 2 or 3 rolls in the first batch, and then the same in each batch following, but you must increase development times with every batch. There was a LONG thread here on this with the Kodak reference! IDK the times OTOMH. Sorry. BUT - STONE, C41 is not like E6.

    PE

  8. #48
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    C-41 processing for neophytes

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Geez guys, just go to the Kodak web site and find it! You can do 2 or 3 rolls in the first batch, and then the same in each batch following, but you must increase development times with every batch. There was a LONG thread here on this with the Kodak reference! IDK the times OTOMH. Sorry. BUT - STONE, C41 is not like E6.

    PE
    *tail between my legs*


    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  9. #49
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    C-41 processing for neophytes

    Wait PE one more thing...

    It's about oxygen and chemistry

    So for example, say I mixed up the full batch of C-41 powder which makes 1 liter. And then put half into a 500ml bottle filled to the brim with only the tinyest air bubble at the top, would that keep for ... 6 months? Or would even that exposure degrade it quickly?

    It's frustrating as the kits only come as 500ml or 1000ml or larger which for home use when all you want to do is 2-4 rolls of color film a month... Gets costly as you are wasting a ton of "usable" developer.

    What say you?

    Even better is there a liquid concentrate that could be sorted into 100ml (or whatever economical ideal size for say no more than 4 rolls of 120 or 2 rolls of 220 or 4 rolls of 135) bottles to be mixed with water as needed?

    Same question for E-6 chemistry?

    I don't want to give up on color chemistry but I think my ignorance about storage and access to "better than kit" chemistry is my downfall.


    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  10. #50
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    I mix up a 5L kit and it lasts me for months in a sealed bottle with no air. Used, I have kept chemistry for 2 - 3 months and fresh up to 6 months, but the key is NO AIR EXPOSURE.

    Actually, I use Nitrogen gas as the 5 L bottle is used, and I store odds and ends in 1L or 1/2L bottles filled to the top.

    PE

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