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  1. #1

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    Ilfochrome substitute

    I am getting desperate for a replacement for Ilfochrome. It needs to be a positive to positive method. Heard of one Fuji was making but seems like it is a goner too. Any ideas? Thanks, Don

  2. #2
    cliveh's Avatar
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    If you are talking transparency, what about duratrans?

    “The contemplation of things as they are, without error or confusion, without substitution or imposture, is in itself a nobler thing than a whole harvest of invention”

    Francis Bacon

  3. #3

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    Hmmmm, that is an interesting thought.

  4. #4
    richard ide's Avatar
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    Duratrans is negative to positive. I don't think there are any other options unfortunately. Emulsion stripping a transparency could be investigated but even if it worked there is size restriction. The only analogue way would be to adapt a proofing system output. Although I have done camera separations; today it would be a hybrid process. It would also give you a vast choice of base papers. Permanence would probably be lacking. The other solution would be multicolor carbro or gumprints.
    Last edited by richard ide; 07-01-2013 at 06:01 PM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: wixed merds
    Richard

    Why are there no speaker jacks on a stereo camera?

  5. #5

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    There is no substitute. I'm gradually homing in on making Portra internegs from chromes for printing onto Fuji Supergloss, which has a similar look. But the masking regimen is different and there are certain other speedbumps I'm trying to work out. The only short term solution is to have
    them scanned and then something like a Lightjet or Lambda onto Supergloss. If you want a challenge you can also work in one of the assembly
    processes like dye transfer or carbon, but the learning curve will be in years, not months. I'm printing directly from color negs for awhile, so
    probably won't get back to the interneg project till next winter.

  6. #6
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    RA4 paper can be reversal processed, and it apparently works for some images, but it is no substitute for Ilfochrome. PE has posted about this - do a search.

    The only all analog way that is likely to be satisfactory is via internegs. Yes, the traditional interneg film has been discontinued, but Portra apparently works pretty well for some folks.

    This is one of those cases where hybrid is the most satisfactory work flow, not because it's inherently better than previous methods but because cancellation of materials pretty much force one to it.

  7. #7
    Poisson Du Jour's Avatar
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    Nope. No real analogue substitutes.
    But alternative (aka skilled-based a-to-d hybridised scan-to-print workflow with high-end printing) have got a big leg up on the staid, inflexible nature of Ilfochrome (to say nothing of dealing with the horrors of the raw media itself) — or I certainly would not be using it! Might be something to look at if you're really desperate. Believe me, I was a sourpuss once about the alternative methods but once you re-skill there is no limit to the quality you can achieve. Again, if that quality was not achievable, I would not be spending fortunes on prints, framing and exhibition (and viewers do know what they are looking at, that's never held back from them).

  8. #8
    Stephen Frizza's Avatar
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    I am about to run out of the last of my Ilfochrome paper and chemical supplies. I have been seeking a substitute and this is what I will say. The closest analog substitute you will find is Ilford Ilfoflex. Having been made by Ilford as an RA-4 material on the same base as Ilfochrome and using dyes that match, with careful tweaking you will be extremely happy with the results. Process is develop in B&W developer, wash, reversal exposure, ra-4 develop, blix, wash. The whole process once controlled is actually better than ilfochrome in some aspects, Contrast is far easier to control.
    "Its my profession to hijack time" ~ Stephen Frizza.

  9. #9
    Oxleyroad's Avatar
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    Stephen, where do you get your Ilfoflex from, US, Europe?
    Cheers - Andy C
    ---------------------

    16mm Cine, 35mm, 120, 5x4 & 7x5.

  10. #10

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    By the same logic you should be able to experiment with reversal processing of Fujiflex. But the dyes in Ilfoflex cannot be same same as in
    Ilfochrome, because azo dyes in that instance require chromolytic removal, and are not related to the chromogenic system of RA4. It would
    also be useful for someone to investigate chemical reversal vs light, so the whole process could be done uninterrupted in drums.

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