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  1. #131
    Ken Nadvornick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Santamaura View Post
    OK, let's add to the list of predictions I make that nobody will listen to. It will be the absolutely correct answer for as long as HARMAN exists.
    You may very well be correct, Sal. Or you may not.

    One of the most difficult things in life I've found to be the case is the attempt to get people to set aside their comfort, fear and inertia in order to try peering into the future. It's an enormously difficult and stressful task for most individuals. And the reasons behind that difficulty have always escaped me, as it's something that I've found just comes as second nature.

    The collective comfort that comes from actively ignoring the past. And the fear that a person has that they might be seen as wrong, especially in public. And the inertia that comes from repeating the exact same thought processes over and over. And any other personal agendas which may be at work. All of these play a part, I'm sure.

    But that stubborn refusal to even consider any possibilities beyond the immediate present just baffles me no end. Just asking someone to take a peek into the crystal ball is like pulling teeth. It's as if time for these individuals has frozen in the current moment, now and forever.

    Which, I suppose, also helps explain your difficulties with getting people to listen to your predictions...



    Ken
    "When making a portrait, my approach is quite the same as when I am portraying a rock. I do not wish to impose my personality upon the sitter, but, keeping myself open to receive reactions from his own special ego, record this with nothing added: except of course when I am working professionally, when money enters in,—then for a price, I become a liar..."

    — Edward Weston, Daybooks, Vol. II, February 2, 1932

  2. #132
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Well, I happen to agree with Sal, and it fact, that is exactly what I have been saying. The only difference is that I give the technical reasons behind my "prediction".

    PE

  3. #133
    Ken Nadvornick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Well, I happen to agree with Sal, and it fact, that is exactly what I have been saying. The only difference is that I give the technical reasons behind my "prediction".
    You may very well be correct, Ron. Or you may not.

    When it comes to times and circumstances changing in the future, possibilities are like that...



    Ken
    "When making a portrait, my approach is quite the same as when I am portraying a rock. I do not wish to impose my personality upon the sitter, but, keeping myself open to receive reactions from his own special ego, record this with nothing added: except of course when I am working professionally, when money enters in,—then for a price, I become a liar..."

    — Edward Weston, Daybooks, Vol. II, February 2, 1932

  4. #134

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    I think our questions about right-sized production of color film (c41 and e6) have just been addressed today over in the Ferrania thread.
    “You seek escape from pain. We seek the achievement of happiness. You exist for the sake of avoiding punishment. We exist for the sake of earning rewards. Threats will not make us function; fear is not our incentive. It is not death that we wish to avoid, but life that we wish to live.” - John Galt

  5. #135

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    Quote Originally Posted by pbromaghin View Post
    I think our questions about right-sized production of color film (c41 and e6) have just been addressed today over in the Ferrania thread.
    Yes they will be making a new E-6 (based on an old one I'm understanding). Also Adox will be making one of their films available in 70mm, 127, 110, etc etc etc basically all roll films and even special orders of even ONE ROLL in their new small scale facility.

    So there's hope for scaled down places to make film forever... like the buggy whip... haha how many times has that guy talked about the buggy whip ... haha but it is true, on a small scale it would be possible to keep film around forever. I hope so...

  6. #136
    AgX
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    Be aware that this all is a statement of intent. As hinted at repeatedly here at Apug the market at least for middle of the road films is marked by the price. And with C-41 films still available for about a Dollar from high productive competitors, how could a new enterprise described as low volume compete with them?

  7. #137

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    Quote Originally Posted by AgX View Post
    Be aware that this all is a statement of intent. As hinted at repeatedly here at Apug the market at least for middle of the road films is marked by the price. And with C-41 films still available for about a Dollar from high productive competitors, how could a new enterprise described as low volume compete with them?
    by offering sizes not available elsewhere, getting them hooked on that film, and then because we often use multiple cameras, easier to standardize on a look we are familiar with so they buy a bunch of different sizes for the same film type... or at least own the market in that format since no one else is making it.

    That's my idea anyway.

  8. #138
    AgX
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    Producing a new film just to gain a conversion competitors do not offer does not seem economic under given circumstances.

  9. #139

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    Quote Originally Posted by AgX View Post
    Producing a new film just to gain a conversion competitors do not offer does not seem economic under given circumstances.
    It's about scale... they only need a small share, and I'll certainly buy their E-6 if it's even halfway good and less than Provia for a lot of color work, Still would use fuji for other work, but can't get that in 127 or 110, or 126, or 70mm or 116/616 etc... get my drift... and there's a lot of cameras out there with no film... I don't think Ilford will do this, it's not big enough for them, at least not now. But they may partner with, or buy out a smaller color production house, perhaps in 10 years, when one or both of the other two film giants collapse, and then it will make sense. it's about timing and market... I'm not saying they should now, that would be dumb, but someday... it might make sense.

  10. #140
    Ken Nadvornick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AgX View Post
    Be aware that this all is a statement of intent. As hinted at repeatedly here at Apug the market at least for middle of the road films is marked by the price. And with C-41 films still available for about a Dollar from high productive competitors, how could a new enterprise described as low volume compete with them?
    Absolutely true. Can't make omelettes until the chicken lays the eggs.

    However...

    A proposed reintroduced (reworked) C-41 product? A proposed reintroduced (reworked) E-6 product? What are these guys thinking? Obviously they have not been reading this thread. Don't they realize those two tasks are impossible to accomplish? Or to even look far enough into the future to consider even trying to do?

    How dare they?

    They may try. They may, or may not, succeed. In either case it may be time again to dust off a little Teddy Roosevelt for the inspiration of our resident your-glass-is-definitely-half-empty crowd:

    "It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." —Theodore Roosevelt

    Ken
    "When making a portrait, my approach is quite the same as when I am portraying a rock. I do not wish to impose my personality upon the sitter, but, keeping myself open to receive reactions from his own special ego, record this with nothing added: except of course when I am working professionally, when money enters in,—then for a price, I become a liar..."

    — Edward Weston, Daybooks, Vol. II, February 2, 1932



 

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