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  1. #11
    cmacd123's Avatar
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    after bleaching you would have to fix, wash and stabilize. (whatever the final rinse is called in your kit.) just bleaching would likely not change the density much.
    Charles MacDonald
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  2. #12
    foc
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    From your description I thought at first it was a retained silver problem with your bleach (ie: not bleached enough or reusing bleach with out proper rep), but on seeing you shot of the negs I think your problem lies elsewhere. Could you have over developed it? Was the dev temp correct?

    I don't have any experience with home kits but have 34 years experience with pro C41 processing. Standard machine C41 is dev 3' 15" @38C +/- 0.1C. The rest of the chemistery has a +/- 2C, you might even get away with more but I never tried it.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by foc View Post
    From your description I thought at first it was a retained silver problem with your bleach (ie: not bleached enough or reusing bleach with out proper rep), but on seeing you shot of the negs I think your problem lies elsewhere. Could you have over developed it? Was the dev temp correct?

    I don't have any experience with home kits but have 34 years experience with pro C41 processing. Standard machine C41 is dev 3' 15" @38C +/- 0.1C. The rest of the chemistery has a +/- 2C, you might even get away with more but I never tried it.
    I have an older mercury thermometer that I calibrated using ice water. I'm fairly sure I kept it at 100°f for 3'15". I do know that I'm a pretty slow getting the developer in and out of the tank, so I may have overdeveloped them. I couldn't have done it for any more than 5 seconds, though. Would that cause such a dark film base?
    Last edited by keyofnight; 07-29-2013 at 05:12 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  4. #14
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    Is there a remote chance that you were given the E6 CD instead of the C41 CD by accident? Also, just for sake of experiment, you could try to bleach a small test clip with a ferricyanide bleach, just to see whether you bleach has gone bad and it was retained silver after all.
    Trying to be the best of whatever I am, even if what I am is no good.

  5. #15
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    If you rebleached without fixing you should definitely see a difference - in that you shouldn't even see the darkness anymore. However, you NEED to fix or that rehalogenated could technically print out since its now "live" again.

    If you saw no difference with your bleaching, and your negs sure look to me like they have silver in them, then your bleach is toast. Bleaching should make the visible silver go nearly invisible. Redeving will bring the silver back to the metallic state OR fixing will remove it permanently.

    I'd make it a priority to figure out what's going on as if the silver is in the rehalogenated state without being fixed that's a bad thing. There's no risk though if your bleach is toast because its still metallic silver.

    That being said it seems pretty unlikely your flexicolor bleach just decided to stop working, especially considering it's not a blix.
    Stop worrying about grain, resolution, sharpness, and everything else that doesn't have a damn thing to do with substance.

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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by clayne View Post
    That being said it seems pretty unlikely your flexicolor bleach just decided to stop working, especially considering it's not a blix.
    I'm thinking that's the problem, though… I don't think it ever worked. I've only tried to process 2 rolls, and they both showed the same problem. It's a shame because the whole set cost a lot more than I should've paid at first. I've heard about bleach failures in other kits with separate bleaches. I took a huge chance in using Flexicolor SM in such a large batch. :/ Win some…lose some.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rudeofus View Post
    Is there a remote chance that you were given the E6 CD instead of the C41 CD by accident? Also, just for sake of experiment, you could try to bleach a small test clip with a ferricyanide bleach, just to see whether you bleach has gone bad and it was retained silver after all.
    I don't have any ferricyanide bleach to test with. I'll see about acquiring some.

  7. #17
    clayne's Avatar
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    If the bleach given to you was bunk, do not fret. This only means you effectively did a 100% bleach bypass or skip-bleach on those negs.

    At any point, you can rebleach and fix to remove the silver. As it is now, the silver is in a metallic fixed state, and you're at no risk of printing out.

    Ferricyanide bleach is easily made with raw potassium ferricyanide powder (completely safe) and potassium bromide. Both available from Artcraft chemicals cheaply. Alternatively you can buy a smaller quantity already mixed up. Use a small amount of concentrate with water you have your working bleach. The concentrate lasts a very long time, the powder forms pretty much indefinitely.

    The entire purpose of bleach is to rehalogenate metallic silver back into silver halide. This means it becomes light sensitive, redevelopable, *and* removable via fixer if not redeveloped. It doesn't matter if you bleach in full light, because the image forming silver is all that is left at this point (since you already fixed before-hand).

    Where'd you get the Flexicolor bleach from?
    Last edited by clayne; 07-30-2013 at 07:16 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    Stop worrying about grain, resolution, sharpness, and everything else that doesn't have a damn thing to do with substance.

    http://www.flickr.com/kediwah

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by clayne View Post
    Where'd you get the Flexicolor bleach from?
    I got my bleach from a big camera shop that has a Kodak account: Glazer's Camera in downtown Seattle, WA. They ordered direct from Kodak.

    So, I guess I'm going to try to acquire potassium ferricyanide and potassium bromide. Two questions…if I switch to a ferricyanide bleach permanently, how would that change my process? Also, how is it even possible that my bleach is bad in the first place?

    I just want to make sure I haven't made some mistake that I'll end up making again...
    Last edited by keyofnight; 07-30-2013 at 10:21 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  9. #19
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    Seems almost impossible that Kodak shipped you bad bleach. What time/temperature did you use the bleach at?
    Stop worrying about grain, resolution, sharpness, and everything else that doesn't have a damn thing to do with substance.

    http://www.flickr.com/kediwah

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by clayne View Post
    Seems almost impossible that Kodak shipped you bad bleach. What time/temperature did you use the bleach at?
    It does seem impossible, but I don't know what alternative explanation I could give. The bleach is already a working solution, so I didn't have to mix it with anything… people have reported success with these chemicals. I aerate the bleach just how others have said they have: keep 500mL of working solution in a 1L bottle, shake like crazy, open the cap, blow in air, shake some more, repeat. I tried to keep the bleach at 100°f like the processing manual says, but the manual also says there's wiggle room (75°f to 105°f if I remember correctly).

    What else could I have done wrong? Could I have contaminated the bleach somehow? I'm not sure how I would've.

    I've run out of ideas.—lol

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