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Thread: Kodachrome

  1. #41
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copake_ham View Post
    Was Mannes the same one who started the Mannes School of Music in NYC? Sounds logical....
    IDK, sounds logical. I think Spock would agree.

    PE

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Kodachrome dyes were at the leading edge of technology when the current process was developed in the 70s. Since then, no new advances have been made, but E6 film technology has advanced considerably and so has dye stability.
    Why was no effort made to improve the Kodachrome products?
    If you're not taking your camera...there's no reason to travel. --APUG member bgilwee

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petzi View Post
    Why was no effort made to improve the Kodachrome products?
    If I were to hazard a guess - Kodak saw a better future and revenue stream from Ektachrome (simple processing) than Kodachrome (complex processing).
    B & D
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  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petzi View Post
    Why was no effort made to improve the Kodachrome products?
    Kodak undertook a big development program for a 400 speed t-grain Kodachrome, but when samples were given out in the late 80s, the reception in the trade was ho-hum. The last ad for Kodachrome was in about 1990, and it shared the spotlight with Ektachrome.

    I really understand how much devoted fans love the product, but the sales are next to nothing right now and have been for nearly 20 years.

    PE

  5. #45
    dmr
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    I'm not a darkroom guru by any means, but I found this item to be very interesting as it explains quite a bit of how Kodachrome actually works, and the steps required to process it. It's out of a manual set for the K-Lab Kodachrome processing machine.

    http://www.kodak.com/global/plugins/...als/z50_03.pdf

    The thing I found interesting is that I have always been told that actual dyes were physically added during processing (kind of like pouring Rit into a washing machine) and this document explains that the dyes are actually a byproduct of the oxidized developers and formed during processing, although one at a time, not all at once as with the Ektachrome type films.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by dmr View Post
    I'm not a darkroom guru by any means, but I found this item to be very interesting as it explains quite a bit of how Kodachrome actually works, and the steps required to process it. It's out of a manual set for the K-Lab Kodachrome processing machine.

    http://www.kodak.com/global/plugins/...als/z50_03.pdf

    The thing I found interesting is that I have always been told that actual dyes were physically added during processing (kind of like pouring Rit into a washing machine) and this document explains that the dyes are actually a byproduct of the oxidized developers and formed during processing, although one at a time, not all at once as with the Ektachrome type films.
    Ever since I read the K-lab manual and how it really explained the process, I've always wondered what sort of deviant developer formulations based on the chemistry would be.

    Like, controlling the contrast and range of individual layers.

  7. #47
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    If you use something like TriX and make 3 color exposures, it is possible to use a very simple developer similar to D76 or the like, but using a color developer and a coupler as the two imaging materials.

    Then, the developer does not need to be complicated.

    The complicated process, as seen in the patent, is due to the fact that the film is a multilayer and diffusion and interimage effects come into play.

    PE

  8. #48
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    Couldn't let it go without resolution!

    Mannes (with Gadowsky) was indeed the inventor of Kodachrome.

    It was his parents actually founded the Mannes School of Music - which he later took charge of after selling the concept to Kodak.

    Although I "cringe" to say it - and checked other sources too - this Wikepedia post does seem to explain it all...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_Mannes

  9. #49
    dmr
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    Quote Originally Posted by copake_ham View Post
    Although I "cringe" to say it - and checked other sources too - this Wikepedia post does seem to explain it all...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_Mannes
    Why would you cringe? That's a very good article.

    One thing that caught my eye is the article refers to Kodachrome as a "chromogenic" process.

    I've always been told that Kodachrome was non-chromogenic, but after studying the Kodak literature, and learning that the dyes are indeed a product of the oxidized developers, I might agree that the term "chromogenic" might be correct here.

    I looked at the Wiki article on Kodachrome, and it uses the term "non-substantive" to differentiate it from the more familiar Kodacolor and Ektachrome type films we all know. (The term "chromogenic" either by itself or prefixed with "non" does not appear to be anywhere within the Wiki Kodachrome article.)

    Maybe PE would care to comment about the semantics of those terms?

  10. #50
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    Chromogenic refers to films in which dyes are formed in the coating. The only non-chromogenic process today is Ilfochrome.

    Substantive, means the couplers are in the film and the developing agent is in the developer, but non-substantive means that both agents are in the developer solution.

    The current Kodachrome process is very very different from what Mannes and Godowsky devised.

    And, BTW, it is Godowsky not Gadowsky.

    PE

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