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  1. #41

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    I know the process used to develop Kodachrome is different from E-6 and C-41 films, but I don't understand why it is not possible to develop 120 in the same machine as 135. I work in a photo lab and the basic principle is that the films are drawn through a series of tanks behind a leader card. The only limit is the width of the lane, so you can do any film up to 120 size; 110, APS, 126, 135, 127, 120... I've done them all the same (to the bemusement of colleagues for the more obscure formats).

    By the way, I have an even more obscure wish: Kodachrome in 126 format to load into my Kodak Instamatic 500.

  2. #42
    tiberiustibz's Avatar
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    The kodachrome process is best run on a "film chain" processor, like that used to process movie film where the film is infinitely long, because of the characteristics of the process and the need to control everything. It is possible to run it in a sink, as I plan to do, but not for large quantities or easily. Most of the processors were designed to process 35mm film, so the machine (ok, the reel like things) is only 35mm wide. You would need twice that width for 120 (70mm) film. You can process super 8 on a 35mm processor, as dwaynes does, but unless you cut it in half you can't process 70mm film on a 35mm processor. The 120 processors all bit the dust when the film was canceled because nobody wanted it.

    E6 film can be processed in a dip and dunk style processor because of two reasons:
    1. It does not need to remove the "rem-jet" anti-halation layer
    2. The film process does not include "re-exposure" whereby the film is exposed to a uniformly controlled light source before each of the color developments.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed110220 View Post
    I know the process used to develop Kodachrome is different from E-6 and C-41 films, but I don't understand why it is not possible to develop 120 in the same machine as 135. I work in a photo lab and the basic principle is that the films are drawn through a series of tanks behind a leader card. The only limit is the width of the lane, so you can do any film up to 120 size; 110, APS, 126, 135, 127, 120... I've done them all the same (to the bemusement of colleagues for the more obscure formats).
    Take a look at this pic:

    http://www.mattosbornephotography.co...kodachrome.jpg

    You can see the rollers on the bottom are smaller, for 35mm, and the ones at the top of the image are the 120 ones. I wonder if any of those machines got mothballed and are still physically intact? Probably not....
    --------------------
    "Everytime I find a film or paper that I like, they discontinue it." -Paul Strand

    www.glasskeyphoto.com

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiberiustibz View Post
    The kodachrome process is best run on a "film chain" processor, .
    I think you mean continous strand processing.
    Don Bryant

  5. #45
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    In some machines it is called "roller transport" as the machine is self feeding. The rollers are undercut in 4 widths and depths. The 120 bridged the outer cut, the 35mm the next smaller, 16mm the next, and super 8 ran in the bottom undercut. Thus, at one time, a single machine could run 4 sizes of film. IDK if this was ever used outside of Kodak or if it was ever even popular. It was mainly intended as an E6 processor as use in Kodachrome was much more difficult due to the agitation/uniformity problem mentioned earlier.

    PE

  6. #46
    AgX
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    Here is something on Kodak's `Kodachrome Minilab´, the K-Lab.

    To my knowledge these had been installed around 1990. That very page is seemingly somehow left over on the Kodak server:

    http://www.kodak.com/global/en/consu...bs/index.shtml

  7. #47

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    Photo Engineer,

    Kodachrome was produced in sheet sizes once upon a time. I know the original suggestion was to cut current production into sheets. Apples and oranges maybe.

    Dwayne's in Kansas is the last K-14 lab in the world. 35mm only. They NEVER processed 120 Kodachrome. Ever. They told me when I called to ask if they could process my 1 roll of 120 Kodachrome.

    For the life of me, I do not understand why Kodak couldn't do once a year special order runs like 120 and/or 4x5 Kodachrome. Panatomic-X in 35mm, 120 & 4x5 would be nice too. Kodak wouldn't need to worry about processing Panatomic-X. People would be required to place an order with a deposit. Kodak could set a certain minimum lot size. If the minimum were met, they would produce the film. Kodak could also have a monopoly on the processing. Sell Kodachrome with pre-paid processing. While were at it, they should get the Polaroid Type 55 P/N equipment from the Bankruptcy court overseeing Poloaroid's Chapter 11 restructuring. That way Kodak could make Type 55 P/N and make their own Readyload products again.

    In my heart, I know this could work. If we got the Bean Counters out of the way, we the consumers could make it work. Look at the Bean Counters track record at Polaroid: They shut down the only part of the company that was worth having. The inventory disappeared in weeks. They could have sold all they could make. 6 months later they are Chapter 11. Go figure.

    Daydream over. We now return you to your regulary scheduled programming.

    Happy New Year!

    Wayne

  8. #48
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    Wayne;

    Sheet film and roll film are coated on different supports. I have tried to explain this many many times. Sheet film must have about 30% greater thickness to lie flat in sheet film holders without buckling. This takes a totally different coating procedure and processing procedure (not counting the fact that sheet film will not go through the roller transport Kodachrome machine).

    As for the current Kodachrome processing machine being able to process 120, of course it cannot. I never said it did. But, at one time there were machines that did 120, 35mm, 16mm and super 8 all by means of properly designed rollers. These machines now exist only as memories or scrap.

    To do any of this, it has to provide a profit. I would guess that at this time some films are going out of date before being sold from the Kodak factory and a lot of film is being returned from photo stores due to being expired. Why make more film than can be sold? Film is like produce in a market or meat in a market. When it goes bad, it is scrap!

    PE

  9. #49
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    4x5 kodachrome was the original ASA 10 kodachrome. it was discontinued in 1953 (ish). I haven't seen any nor heard of anybody seeing any since about then. It doesn't work in the modern K14 kodachrome process, the K12 included a pre-hardener.

    Have you ever used sheet film? It doesn't curl when you dry it, it stays flat. Imagine using sheet film that curled and was really flimsy which you couldn't process.

    Try meeting the minimum order. It's not going to happen.

    Why do I feel like lots of people say the exact same thing as wayne...

  10. #50
    dmr
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    Quote Originally Posted by AgX View Post
    Here is something on Kodak's `Kodachrome Minilab´, the K-Lab.

    To my knowledge these had been installed around 1990. That very page is seemingly somehow left over on the Kodak server:
    Very interesting, thanks.

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