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  1. #21
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    I should add that the dmin of color prints was about 0.20 with a yellow bias right out of the process, and todays color papers are about 0.10 or less right out of the process. This is due to RC support, a better process (RA developer without benzyl alcohol), brighteners, and the new hardener among other things.

    PE

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I should add that the dmin of color prints was about 0.20 with a yellow bias right out of the process, and todays color papers are about 0.10 or less right out of the process. This is due to RC support, a better process (RA developer without benzyl alcohol), brighteners, and the new hardener among other things.

    PE
    Hmm - If there had been enough demand to support color FB paper development until today, I wonder if it would indeed look as good as B&W FB

  3. #23
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    I suspect that it would not. I have seen exactly the same coating done on FB and RC and with exactly the same images printed on them. The RC was far better. I suspect that would still be the case.

    And, the cost would be about 2x higher due to the cost of FB material and to the modifications needed when coating. It requires quite a bit different drying setup for FB than for RC. At least it did at EK.

    PE

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I suspect that it would not. I have seen exactly the same coating done on FB and RC and with exactly the same images printed on them. The RC was far better. I suspect that would still be the case.

    And, the cost would be about 2x higher due to the cost of FB material and to the modifications needed when coating. It requires quite a bit different drying setup for FB than for RC. At least it did at EK.

    PE
    Oh well - I'd be happy if they could just make RC paper with the same surface texture as FB.

  5. #25
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    It cannot be done with B&W and therefore by analogy cannot be done for color. The surface property problems are quite similar. We did extensive studies of this. The best to be achieved on RC is glossy, matte, pearl, and silk, but FB had suede, tapestry, and a whole host of other surfaces that just did not carry over to RC well.

    At one time, there were 19 surfaces for Azo paper alone.

    Time change.

    And, BTW, these exotic surfaces are not available for digital either so it is a widespread market issue.

    PE

  6. #26
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    Dye Transfer prints were made on fiber paper. I miss that process, it was fun to do. There used to be display materials on a polyester base as well, Kodak Duratrans and Duraflex. Agfa and others made similar materials. I liked making prints on such material, the poly base gave the prints a certain pearlesence that the RC paper did not have. It was a similar to ciba in that respect, but much easier to work with.
    Considering that you can't judge color on a wet print, printing on fiber would be much slower, and for what payoff? I can't see any advantage.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by erikg View Post
    Considering that you can't judge color on a wet print, printing on fiber would be much slower, and for what payoff? I can't see any advantage.
    Umm - because FB papers have a much nicer surface texture - RC paper looks like a shiny piece of plastic - which is exactly what it is.

  8. #28
    AgX
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikg View Post
    There used to be display materials on a polyester base as well, Kodak Duratrans and Duraflex. Agfa and others made similar materials.

    Agfa offers a dual-process print film which can be processed in C-41 and in RA-4:

    `Avitone CP 70´

  9. #29

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    But now we do have various fiber papers for color with inkjet prints. The variety and quality of the papers is amazing. In conjunction with regular c-prints, there's a much wider and better selection of papers than ever before.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcfactor View Post
    But now we do have various fiber papers for color with inkjet prints. The variety and quality of the papers is amazing. In conjunction with regular c-prints, there's a much wider and better selection of papers than ever before.
    The variety of surfaces for inkjet is far smaller than that once available to color paper and B&W paper enthusiasts. I wonder why?

    PE

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