Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 69,872   Posts: 1,520,114   Online: 882
      
Page 1 of 7 1234567 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 61
  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    1,089
    Images
    2

    Why is Tungsten film so slow?

    I would love it if there was a Tungsten balanced 800 speed colour neg film, for the low light situations that I am almost inevitably in when I need tungsten balanced film.

  2. #2
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Minnesota
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    14,161
    Images
    288
    I think because you can normally control the lighting indoors by increasing the power of your light sources.

    - Thomas
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    373
    There used to be Kodak EPJ 320T E-6 film, which you could push a stop or two if you had to. Many used it for stage shooting.

    The closest thing today would probably be the process ECN-II tungsten negative films. Kodak makes Vision 500T, and Fuji makes Eterna 500T. I do not know if you can push-process in ECN-II chemistry, but I am interested in finding out the answer from an expert, as I am sure you are also.

    Another option would be to use a high-speed daylight C-41 negative film, such as Portra 800, Fuji 800Z, or Fuji Superia 1600, and push process it several stops, with or without a filter to compensate for the color temperature of tungsten light (partially or fully depending on how blue the filter is, but with lose of speed).

  4. #4
    2F/2F's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    8,008
    Images
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bertilsson View Post
    I think because you can normally control the lighting indoors by increasing the power of your light sources.

    - Thomas
    ...if all of your photography is staged.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  5. #5
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Minnesota
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    14,161
    Images
    288
    I thought that was how most of that type of film was shot anyway? I've used some Kodak tungsten E6 film in the past, but only in staged lighting. I don't think I'd use just ambient lighting for indoor portraits or something for the fear of running into obscenely long times with reciprocity failure.
    But I'm not much of a studio artist, perhaps somebody with more experience in the matter can chime in?

    - Thomas
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    1,089
    Images
    2
    I thought that was what (for example) Portra 800 was for, indoor shots without a flash, do most pro labs correct the white balance for you?

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Westminster, Maryland, USA
    Shooter
    8x10 Format
    Posts
    1,504
    'Cause Tungsten film was originally designed for studio hot lights, so it was assumed you'd be shooting on tripod with little movement, if any in your subject.

    Better to use fast color negative film.
    When I grow up, I want to be a photographer.

    http://www.walterpcalahan.com/Photography/index.html

  8. #8

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    509
    Quote Originally Posted by ajuk View Post
    I thought that was what (for example) Portra 800 was for, indoor shots without a flash, do most pro labs correct the white balance for you?
    any decent lab will color correct. However, the results will be much worse than if you had used a tungsten film, or had filtered pre-exposure.

  9. #9
    2F/2F's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    8,008
    Images
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bertilsson View Post
    I thought that was how most of that type of film was shot anyway? I've used some Kodak tungsten E6 film in the past, but only in staged lighting. I don't think I'd use just ambient lighting for indoor portraits or something for the fear of running into obscenely long times with reciprocity failure.
    But I'm not much of a studio artist, perhaps somebody with more experience in the matter can chime in?

    - Thomas
    Kodak 320T and 160T were my most used films. They are gone. Even when I was shooting them,my film was almost or already expired. I used them for any color I shot in low light. I used them a lot for night street shooting and shooting in clubs, parties, etc.; usually overdeveloped +2 or +1. I used them once to shoot a friend's fashion show sans flash, and the pix looked really good (subject matter aside). Many others use them a lot for studio stuff. I use them when I want to shoot a still life in studio, or anything else with tungsten lamps or clear flashbulbs.

    Reciprocity failure does not occur for quite some time with tungsten balanced films. That is another of their great characteristics.

    They are mostly slow now because, frankly, digital is "superior" in many ways for low light high ISO hand held work, so there isn't a lot of demand for the fast ones. Also, as you stated, not a ton of people used them for available light work. There must still be enough demand for the ISO 64 varieties to keep them alive (thank heavens). When they finally go, it will be a pretty sad day for me!

    I miss pushed 320T a lot, but usually Fuji Press 800 does OK, and they are cheaper and easier to print. Most print shops just do it digitally now, and color neg films scan very well, so having the pix on transparency film is not all that much of an advantage to printers like it used to be. Like I said, however, I still miss having it as an option, and if there were a tungsten balanced version of Fuji Press 800, it would be almost all that I use for color film in low light.
    Last edited by 2F/2F; 11-02-2008 at 06:38 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  10. #10
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    22,907
    Images
    65
    Most everyone uses high intensity strobes indoors so the "art" of using tungsten for candid or for studio shots began dying out. Work on new products is expensive and keeping on making the poor runners is also expensive, so high speed tungsten films began dying out.

    I have never designed a tungsten film before, but have designed tungsten papers, and there are technical details to consider. For daylight film, the "swing" layer is blue sensitive, but for tungsten film the "swing" layer is the red sensitive layer due to the relative energies. This introduces a lot of differences into the product with respect to speed balance in color films, and a lot of choices for color temperature as well. This ends up with compromise to a greater extent than in daylight balance films.

    PE

Page 1 of 7 1234567 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin