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  1. #11
    nsouto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heinz_Anderle View Post
    Fuji has tacitly phased out most 4-color layer negative films (Superia X-tra 100, 200, and 400) and replaced them with 3-color layer films, also available as several drugstore chains' private label films for a very moderate price (Fujicolor 100, Superia 200 = C200, Superia 400, and equivalents). I like the new Superia 200 = C200 for its perfect hybrid capabilities, while the crappy prints I got with tis film from commercial photofinishers are by no means of any use in judging a film's quality today. All these new films have a lighter mask and a quite high contrast as optimized for scanning in the widespread Fuji Frontier minilabs, and an excellent dynamic range for exposure at nominal speed without losing shadow detail, but they don't tolerate overexposure too well. Maybe the new film has a flatter gradation.

    Wasn't aware they had phased out the 4-layr stuff. But I did indeed notice a major change with Superia 400. It is now by far my preferred 400ISO colour negative film: scans much easier with its shiny emulsion side and has a colour response that I particularly like whilenot being overly contrasty. And the grain is much less obtrusive, which makes for much easier and faster post-processing.

    I hope this new one shows up soon here in Australia, at an acceptable price. Provia 400X is a superb film, but its price here is beyond belief: much more expensive than any other 400 slide film, which makes it almost a luxury item. Even through ebay it's still waaaay too expensive...
    Cheers
    Noons (Nuno Souto)
    Gallery here

  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    ... We tailored all of our color films to have spectral sensitivities to cover all possible skin tones ... with teenagers with severe acne in between. ...PE
    Kodachrome 200 (indoors with flash) for the Zombie effect, and Velvia 50 for the full spectrum in the skin AND circulation disease medical textbooks.


  3. #13
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heinz_Anderle View Post
    Kodachrome 200 (indoors with flash) for the Zombie effect, and Velvia 50 for the full spectrum in the skin AND circulation disease medical textbooks.

    Heinz;

    You are correct about Kodachrome, but at least all flesh tone types suffer equally!

    That is one reason I don't like Kodachrome.

    And I never said that I liked the Acne effect. AAMOF, Agfa products were noted for the Acne effect and were quite bad at the time. We worked hard to give the right tone but gloss over the acne. It was not easy. I might describe it some day.

    PE

  4. #14

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    All i know is......


    I emailed Kodak, and DEMANDED Extar 100 in 4x5.

    should be here soon, I guess.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by bspeed View Post
    All i know is......


    I emailed Kodak, and DEMANDED Extar 100 in 4x5.

    should be here soon, I guess.
    Maybe not, I think the problem with multiple formats is that 35mm and 4x5 are different thicknesses. According to Ilford, 35mm is ~.125mm, 120/220 is ~.110mm and large format is ~.180mm. That means that you have to know that you will sell enough in each size to use up the entire batch of that thickness before the film expires. I know the answer is smaller batches, but that might make it too expensive, especially for a company like Kodak who's Modus Operandi is to make massively huge batches at a time.
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

  6. #16
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Kodak can make a single master roll, but the problem is that the coating machine just cannot change support types. It must be adjusted for the thickness of that support. The hopper must be repositioned and the drying is different as heat transport through the film is different.

    All of this takes some degree of development which costs money up-front and must be charged for. To do this development to make 1 master roll means that the customer must pay for as many trial runs as needed to get 1 master roll of good stuff.

    You willing?

    PE

  7. #17

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    It seems that Kodak (and all other companies too) needs to figure out how to produce films much more cost effectively. It is a race against the digital technology. It is obvious that digital sensors are getting cheaper at a stunning rate over time. They simply are able to be more cost effective in making digital sensors. If cost of making films stays at the same place or grows more expensively it will not survive the competition. It really makes little sense to produce a great film such as Ektar 100 but only in 35 mm format. For Ektar 100 to have a strong hold in the market Kodak really needs to make 120/220 and LF formats for the film. Kodak's top priority is to figure out how to cut cost in making them. If it can not be done the film will come and go just like many other great films Kodak made in the past. That would be very sad. Let's keep fingers crossed and hope Kodak figures out how to keep Ektar100 (in more formats) alive.

  8. #18
    tiberiustibz's Avatar
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    Is it not possible to coat films in smaller runs? If not then every step of R&D would require a $250K coating run... Is it possible to coat color films one layer at a time?

  9. #19
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    A research scale run is about 1000 feet of 4.5" film or paper. The next size is 1000 feet of 11" film or paper, and the next is 21" wide and about 1000 ft. So, my last post referred to production which is 42" x 5000 ft. Smaller research runs can be made with difficulty.

    A research coating runs about $25,000.

    Those are my estimates and are provided that the respective equipment is still in operation.

    The ROI for film products is very very good and Kodak continues to profit from the film sales remaining on the products still selling.

    PE
    Last edited by Photo Engineer; 01-01-2009 at 04:33 PM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: Added info

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtjade2007 View Post
    It seems that Kodak (and all other companies too) needs to figure out how to produce films much more cost effectively. It is a race against the digital technology. It is obvious that digital sensors are getting cheaper at a stunning rate over time. They simply are able to be more cost effective in making digital sensors. If cost of making films stays at the same place or grows more expensively it will not survive the competition. It really makes little sense to produce a great film such as Ektar 100 but only in 35 mm format. For Ektar 100 to have a strong hold in the market Kodak really needs to make 120/220 and LF formats for the film. Kodak's top priority is to figure out how to cut cost in making them. If it can not be done the film will come and go just like many other great films Kodak made in the past. That would be very sad. Let's keep fingers crossed and hope Kodak figures out how to keep Ektar100 (in more formats) alive.
    One thing to remember, digital sensors essentially run into the same kind of problem that computer processors do, over time the same amount improvement becomes less of a deal. For example going from a 2MP to a 4MP sensor is a 100% improvement, going from a 10MP to a 12MP is a 20% improvement, going from a 20MP sensor to a 22MP sensor is a 10% improvement. Yet the generational development costs remain the same or even increase.

    You also run into the technology wall known as good enough. If my largest print is an 8x10, then a 6-8MP camera is good enough. So if you have an 8MP camera and replace it with a 10MP camera and see no real difference in the final print, then you are unlikely to buy the 12MP camera if there is no new feature other then the bump in Megapixels. Over time there are fewer and fewer new "wow" features you can add to the camera.

    Films once they are developed, can be made for years without many big changes, In fact, often the users of that film, don't want changes made to it. I expect that over time, film production runs will get adjusted, and they will use robotic cutters so that there is less or no trimming waste. They will also start to look for processes that recycle what trimming waste, they do have. Think about how much silver is on all those little bits punched out for the perforations on 35mm film....
    Paul Schmidt
    See my Blog at http://clickandspin.blogspot.com

    The greatest advance in photography in the last 100 years is not digital, it's odourless stop bath....

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