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  1. #11

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    Find and PM the guy from the thread a few months ago who lives up in the N.E.U.S.A. (was is VT or NH?) and does all those great astro photos. He knows all about long exposures for all sorts of films, and even mentioned something about E-200 in that thread, I believe.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ektagraphic View Post
    The people I am going with will shoot digital at ISO 100. Should I follow suit so that I can use the same exposures that they do?
    Besides reciprocity, another thing that needs to be remembered about digital is that digital cameras often deliberately overexpose the shot. They do this in order to lower noise and better utilize the dynamic range of the sensor. Of course, they also do this since it is understood that the overexposure will be corrected in post-processing. On the other hand, overexposure is one of the biggest no-nos there is when it comes to shooting ANY kind of slide film. So be careful with this. If the people shooting digital are getting well-exposed shots using manual settings, then you will probably do okay with their settings. But otherwise, you might not want to use what they are using.

  3. #13
    hrst's Avatar
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    Digital Cameras are most sensitive for overexposure; they have no shoulder at all and clip very abruptly. That's why they almost always try to underexpose the scene; rather than overexpose. This is especially true with newer cameras as people have complained about clipping. So: digital cameras deliberately UNDERexpose the shot, to give that popular blocked-shadow look.

    I've used a compact digital camera as a light meter when exposing slides at night. Usually you can expose slide even a stop more; so, when you look at the digital picture, the areas that are blown a little will be alright on the slide. Where digital clips, there starts the short shoulder of slide film. It's not much but it's there. When it looks like this with digital: http://sorsa-tv.ath.cx/~antalh/broni...ustestit/5.jpg (look at the blown-out sky), it comes okay with Velvia 50 with the same exposure (plus compensated for reciprocity failure).

    But, the ISO values in digital cameras differ very much, more than one stop between manufacturers. In addition, they fake their highest ISO values, or maybe all of them. You really cannot say without comparing a particular digital camera to a particular film. This has come very clear today as I have been wondering these ISO 25600 shots of the new Nikon D3s all around the Web, and they are almost always both underexposed and blocked-shadows, true speed being much lower, something like ISO 3200-6400.

    So, the bottom line is that I would expose slide at the same rating than with digital. It can be under or over but you can't know without testing. If I had to place a bet, I would say that it's half a stop under rather than over.

    And, about the digital not having the reciprocity failure; it's true but in a sense they have same kind of problem; it's the huge noise buildup regardless of ISO value when using long exposures. Even 60 sec exposure (even at ISO400) can be very fatal to digital image. This is much temperature-dependent and if you have cold winter night at -30 deg. C then you will probably be completely ok with 120 sec exposures.

    Now I spoke about d*git*l in APUG . Forgive me.
    Last edited by hrst; 10-14-2009 at 08:56 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by hrst View Post
    Digital Cameras are most sensitive for overexposure; they have no shoulder at all and clip very abruptly. That's why they almost always try to underexpose the scene; rather than overexpose. This is especially true with newer cameras as people have complained about clipping. So: digital cameras deliberately UNDERexpose the shot, to give that popular blocked-shadow look.
    This might be true with compact digitals, which clip at the drop of a hat and have zero dynamic range. But from my experience with my 5D, the meter always seems to set the exposure in such a way that the brightest highlights are typically just short of clipping (or, in extreme cases, just starting to clip). This usually results in an overexposed shot.
    Last edited by StorminMatt; 10-14-2009 at 04:43 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  5. #15
    Derek Lofgreen's Avatar
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    I shoot E200 at night a lot. It has minimal if any reciprocity failure up to a minute (from my experience and eye, not a scientist or engineer here). I shoot with a buddy that shoots digital at the same time. I keep notes on my exposures and can compare to his digi files. They are close some times but more times than not I get better exposures when shot 1 stop over what he is shooting. I spot meter on the brightest light in the scene to get a baseline exposure, then change it two stops more for my first exposure so that the dark areas will be exposed properly. I bracket from there. Hope it helps.

    D.
    My Photography Site www.lofgreenimages.com and My Blog

  6. #16
    Ektagraphic's Avatar
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    So maybe I will push process and see what happens keeping exposures around 1 min or a little more.
    Helping to save analog photography one exposure at a time

  7. #17
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    E200 and Elite Chrome 200 has excellent reciprocity and little color shift. I have exposed it under Moonlight with 20 to 30 minute exposures and you would swear the frames were taken in daylight. These films continue to record light well into 2 hours plus before dropping off. There is some reciprocity loss, but I would think it would be one stop or less over many minutes. This is why it is the best color film for astrophotography

    30 minutes at f/4 105mm lens Pentax 67 E200 pushed +2 stops
    Film? What's that? It's like digital, only better

    Flickr - Nightfly Photography
    Nightfly Astrophotography

  8. #18

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    I think the consumer grade Kodak Elite 200 works just as well at night.
    This was pushed 1 stop, 45 minutes at f/2.8 under a quarter moon just after it rose above the mountains.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 3284978-Lunar Illumination small.jpg  

  9. #19
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    Ektachrome 200 is great at long exposures. This guy here on apug uses it for astrophotograpy with excellent results. I think the site for his work was like Nightfly Zoomyshare or something...


    *Edit*
    Oh... Just looked above...
    www.EASmithV.com

    "The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera."— Dorothea Lange
    http://www.flickr.com/easmithv/
    RIP Kodachrome

  10. #20
    Athiril's Avatar
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    The best film ive found for reciprocity is Astia 100f.

    edit: just looking at fuji's data sheet and for up to a minute, there is no reciprocity failure, and no colour correction

    for 2 minutes fuji recommends 5B filter + 1/3 stop compensation, 4 min 5B + 1/2 stop and 8 min is 5B + 2/3 stop
    Last edited by Athiril; 10-19-2009 at 10:09 AM. Click to view previous post history.

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