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  1. #21
    MikeSeb's Avatar
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    @Greg, @frotog, et al: I hope the petition helps. Seriously.

    @hrst: thank you for the promotion up from "lurker". I suppose @BradS and I will now have to draw straws to see which of us will become "troll" and which, "troublemaker". I do look quite fetching in green....
    Michael Sebastian
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  2. #22

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    Eastman Kodak

    The fact that Eastman Kodak is still in business is testimony to the fact that they have made tough decisions for the sole purpose of being able to fight another day. Just take a look at the stock price.

    The market is in the midst of a necessary consolidation and many many favorite products will cease to exist in order for the business to continue forward. This was the case in the 1930's when Edward Weston was making images and it is the case now. It is never easy but life will go on.

    Unless you have an interest in putting large amount of financial resources into the pot to insure your desired outcome you are wasting your time with the petition process. The train has long ago left the station. Find a substitute and/or change your process and move on.

    Cheers!
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  3. #23
    Greg Davis's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, the only options in this case are to have a lab print my work, which is too much of a drain on time and money compared to my own darkroom, or to print via inkjet, which is too much of a drain on time and money compared to my darkroom.

    I can work around this VC paper's attributes. I'm not married to the current Supra so much that I can't print anything else. The lack of sheet sizes, however, is a serious problem. And not just for me.
    www.gregorytdavis.com

    Did millions of people suddenly disappear? This may have an answer.

    "No one knows that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." -Matthew 24:36

  4. #24

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    Freestyle lists the Supra Endura paper as out of stock, but will have more on the 23. I noticed that some of the listings for Supra Endura had a (N) in the name http://www.freestylephoto.biz/158738...-N?cat_id=1201
    and some had an (F) http://www.freestylephoto.biz/155657...-F?cat_id=1201 . What's the difference? (Please excuse my ignorance).
    "I have captured the light and arrested its flight! The sun itself shall draw my pictures!"

    -Louis Daguerre, 1839-

  5. #25
    Greg Davis's Avatar
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    It is the amount of gloss on the surface. F is glossy, N is semi-matte. There are still boxes of Supra at Kodak that has yet to be distributed, so the material is not gone yet. It may take months or years to sell it all. However, once it is gone, it is gone for good.
    www.gregorytdavis.com

    Did millions of people suddenly disappear? This may have an answer.

    "No one knows that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." -Matthew 24:36

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Davis View Post
    It is the amount of gloss on the surface. F is glossy, N is semi-matte.
    That simple, eh? If i had paid more attention, I probably could have figured that out myself :/

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Davis View Post
    There are still boxes of Supra at Kodak that has yet to be distributed, so the material is not gone yet. It may take months or years to sell it all. However, once it is gone, it is gone for good.
    I may have time to save up for a developing tank and a few packs of it before it's all gone.

    Just out of curiosity, how does the Supra endura compare to Fuji papers? Is there a Fuji paper that's comparable to Supra Endura?
    "I have captured the light and arrested its flight! The sun itself shall draw my pictures!"

    -Louis Daguerre, 1839-

  7. #27
    Ken Nadvornick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Kadillak View Post
    Unless you have an interest in putting large amount of financial resources into the pot to insure your desired outcome you are wasting your time with the petition process. The train has long ago left the station. Find a substitute and/or change your process and move on.
    Perhaps.

    But unless I am somehow mistaken it is, after all, their time to waste, is it not?

    Who are we to tell them how they can and cannot waste their time? Not all in the world think alike on every issue. If one disagrees with the content of their petition, simply do not sign it. A win-win situation for all involved.

    Ken

  8. #28
    hrst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeSeb View Post
    @Greg, @frotog, et al: I hope the petition helps. Seriously.
    This is very nice to hear - seriously.

    I suppose @BradS and I will now have to draw straws to see which of us will become "troll" and which, "troublemaker". I do look quite fetching in green....
    Well, only you can decide about yourself; there are no judges. I'm honestly sorry; my intention was not to give a judgement, just to tell you how disappointed I was when I saw some people making fun of the ones making the petition, generally underestimating our intelligence. I've seen that on some photography forums, and after a while, it has led to complete decay in photographic discussions. Probably I'm just oversensitive and paranoid for this kind of things, as this certainly isn't your nor BradS' intention. I'm sorry.

    But, after all, petition is just a list of names. Consider it as a list of devoted Supra Endura users. Even if it was completely futile, so what? It takes only a few seconds to sign, and a few minutes to send. I think we all understand that in addition to petition, we also have to show our engagement in this product by buying it as long as it is available; and, of course, also start finding alternative products. But the petition will still give some numbers to KODAK about devoted Supra Endura users. Let's give KODAK a chance to decide what to do with this petition -- because, as said before, no one of us have worked for that kind of company.

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Nadvornick View Post
    Perhaps.

    But unless I am somehow mistaken it is, after all, their time to waste, is it not?

    Who are we to tell them how they can and cannot waste their time? Not all in the world think alike on every issue. If one disagrees with the content of their petition, simply do not sign it. A win-win situation for all involved.

    Ken
    As long as this remains a free country by all means you have a right to expend your time in whatever manner you chose. If promoting a petition such as the one promoted in this post is of interest of anyone then by all means go for it.

    I will choose to draw upon my experience in dealing with Kodak at the executive level on issues identical to this one. If you want to solve this problem expend your energy aggregating hard orders from interested consumers and then present Kodak with an order for this product for $50,000 to $100,000. That is the only thing that will get this process moving. And the clock for this option is ticking rather quickly.

    Over the years if there is one thing I have learned particularly when it relates to silver photographic products it is simply this:

    Money talks and bullshit walks......

  10. #30
    Greg Davis's Avatar
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    In all fairness (and I know my earlier words were harsh and combative, for that I apologize), I do not feel the petition I signed will have any effect in preserving Supra. I believe a more realistic goal would be a petition to have the new paper available in cut sheet form. No, it won't be the same paper. It will, however, allow smaller users access to home printing, even if it is not ideal. Their Edge paper is a lower cost, lower quality paper that I would rather not use if avoidable in my own work and that of my students. Higher contrast can be dealt with, color balance can be dealt with, but no sheet sizes won't work. Perhaps they have plans to offer it in sheets once the current supply dries up, I don't know. I would like to hear something from them addressing this.
    www.gregorytdavis.com

    Did millions of people suddenly disappear? This may have an answer.

    "No one knows that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." -Matthew 24:36

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