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  1. #11
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    I hope so. IDK what Tetenal supplies as bleach. I know what Kodak and Fuji supply. I know that the bleaching process goes to completion and does not need a starter.

    PE

  2. #12
    AgX
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    PE,

    This Starter thing for Bleaches is confusing. At Fuji-Hunt there are different C-41 Bleaches. Some need a Starter, one some nitric acid for the Replenisher, others none at all. For the latter Fresh Tank Solution is made by just diluting Replenisher Solution (or diluting Replenisher Concentrate even more..)
    Last edited by AgX; 11-10-2009 at 08:55 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  3. #13

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    Hm, okay. Will try it out. My current bleach batch is 'started' with some Kodak starter.

  4. #14
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    I believe that the starter is just buffer and halide to insure that the startup pH is what is to be expected in a seasoned tank. The problem is that in the range of about 5.5 - 6.7 pH is not critical. Of course this depends on Bleach. Bleach III is lower in pH than the older bleaches. (Bleach III is greenish and earlier bleaches are reddish)

    AFAIK, there is no significant effect given to a bleach by the starter as long as the silver is bleached at the right pH. Going to acidic will destroy dyes and going too acidic will stop bleaching action. As soon as bleaching starts, it is "seasoned" in the sense that the film being bleached rapidly changes the environment anyhow.

    PE

  5. #15

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    So then, this is confusing:

    http://www.adorama.com/KKFCBSG.html

    "Bleach starter", by Kodak. All the other chemicals are in stock at Adorama except this. If it's not necessary, then I'd love to not wait for it to come in stock, just buy the Silver Pixel version of Bleach III replenisher off eBay instead and mix w/ water.

  6. #16
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    Bleaching goes to completion and has a wider effective temperature range, and so technically a starter only refines the end result for the photofinisher who must get good results in the standard process. If by some chance, you observe a result that is off due to bleach or fix, you can repeat those steps to repair any problem that lack of starter might, on a long shot, cause. The photofinsher cannot.

    The starter is a "just in case" chemical. It is not mandatory. Developer starter is the only mandatory starter that must be used with a replenisher.

    I think I have answered this same question in 3 threads just today.

    PE

  7. #17

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    That's why we need a sticky about C-41 processing . Thanks so much for all your advice PE, this makes sense AND saves some money. With the Silver Pixel bleach replenisher from ebay this brings the cost of Kodak chems down to the same price as Tetenal/Arista kits.

  8. #18
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    I have no experience except with Kodak and Fuji kits, so my answers only apply to them. I can extrapolate and be pretty accurate, but IDK enough nor have enough money to buy and test every kit out there.

    PE

  9. #19

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    Back in the bad old days bleach starter was ammonia to control ph in a fresh mix to prevent leuco cyan problems. The modern films don't seem to be sensitive to this in about the last 10 years or so.
    So unless you are using one of the special short time bleaches for some mini labs that are stronger than standard stuff I wouldn't worry about it.

  10. #20
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    They still are, so pH is a concern.

    PE

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