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  1. #21
    lxdude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    No, many in the UK preferred Fuji slide films because they gave more faithful colour rendering.

    Ian
    Maybe because of the frequent cloudiness?
    I mean, I don't like Velvia much, but under heavy cloud cover it shines. I've always lived in sunny places and to me the old Fujichrome 100 was sort of posterish and overdone and not nearly as true as the Kodachromes. The Fujichrome did have really pretty greens, which sorry to say, are what has faded most.

    I still preferred it to the old Ektachromes, which were too blue. When a bright orange California Poppy comes out looking yellowish, well...

    Like Eric, I liked Agfachrome 64 best (after Kodachrome). Well balanced colors, slightly warm with creamy whites. Meshed well with Kodachrome. And it has resisted fading really well, with 35 year old slides still beautiful.
    Last edited by lxdude; 07-16-2010 at 03:00 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by lxdude View Post
    Maybe because of the frequent cloudiness?
    I mean, I don't like Velvia much, but under heavy cloud cover it shines.
    I too find that cloudy skies don't significantly affect the performance of velvia, and indeed it can do very nice things with low contrast scenes. I learned that under very cloudy skies in Arizona.

    Anyway, my preferred flavour of velvia is velvia 100, and it should be noted that that many of the hardened opinions on velvia are based on early velvia 50... not 100 or 100F. Anyway, velvia and skintones... not good! Velvia 100F if you must, but I wouldn't unless the surrounding environment had really compelling reasons to do so e.g. verdant rice paddies in Indonesia or something like that!

    Provia's colour accuracy is good if the colour temp of the light is bang on 5000 K. But it tends to blue up on me for almost any light that I like to shoot with. In my opinion it is not a good choice unless you colour meter. Actually I prefer the colour rendition of 400x to provia 100F. 400x is the bomb.

    On the other hand, astia 100F has worked well for me in very challenging light, even quite mixed. Attached is a very recent example from a camping trip. Broad daylight and very deep shadows, white whites, but notice that the skintones are quite good, not requiring any adjustments. You may not be able to tell form the attachment, but the shadow detail is mostly all there and the highlights are good too. This was high noon light.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails hike014_sm_apug.jpg  
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  3. #23
    JohnArs's Avatar
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    EPN was the only film with exactly grey tones and all over one of the best, with Astia the second!

    Cheers Armin
    Good light and nice shadows!

    www.artfoto.ch

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    No, many in the UK preferred Fuji slide films because they gave more faithful colour rendering.
    When my dad was in the camera business, he saw some actual research---I think it was published and everything---that found that, in (very) general, Fuji's colour films were deemed more realistic than Kodak's by Japanese viewers, and the reverse by American viewers. (I don't remember if it was specific to either print or slide.)

    So I think you're saying that the British are more Japanese than they are American? :-)

    Personally, I find Provia 100F to be nicely realistic, but everyone has their own taste in these matters. People really do perceive colours differently.

    -NT
    Nathan Tenny
    San Diego, CA, USA

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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by keithwms View Post
    I too find that cloudy skies don't significantly affect the performance of velvia, and indeed it can do very nice things with low contrast scenes. I learned that under very cloudy skies in Arizona.

    Anyway, my preferred flavour of velvia is velvia 100, and it should be noted that that many of the hardened opinions on velvia are based on early velvia 50... not 100 or 100F. Anyway, velvia and skintones... not good! Velvia 100F if you must, but I wouldn't unless the surrounding environment had really compelling reasons to do so e.g. verdant rice paddies in Indonesia or something like that!

    Provia's colour accuracy is good if the colour temp of the light is bang on 5000 K. But it tends to blue up on me for almost any light that I like to shoot with. In my opinion it is not a good choice unless you colour meter. Actually I prefer the colour rendition of 400x to provia 100F. 400x is the bomb.

    On the other hand, astia 100F has worked well for me in very challenging light, even quite mixed. Attached is a very recent example from a camping trip. Broad daylight and very deep shadows, white whites, but notice that the skintones are quite good, not requiring any adjustments. You may not be able to tell form the attachment, but the shadow detail is mostly all there and the highlights are good too. This was high noon light.


    Velvia 50's design intent is for exposure in diffuse illumination — as pointed out above, it delivers the best results in low contrast light. Bingo. I rarely expose it without a polariser, but this is due to the subject matter and print process (Ilfochrome).

    It was not designed nor intended for bright sun exposure. That applies to 50, 100, 100F. For bright sun, Provia 100F.

    Try it, but Velvia 100 didn't go down well with me in target light, even worse in marginal light.
    .::Gary Rowan Higgins

    A comfort zone is a wonderful place. But nothing ever grows there.
    —Anon.






  6. #26
    2F/2F's Avatar
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    I vote for EPN if you can get some. Then EPP if you can get some. Then E100G if you can't get either. If you like the look of E100G, but want a warmer color balance, try to find some [discontinued] E100GX. If you can't, try an 81-series filter on the E100G.

    Provia is pretty neutral, and I have shot a $hit-ton of it (used to be my go-to daylight transparency film) though now I find the Kodak emulsions to look more attractive over all, in a subjective aesthetic sense. Astia is pretty neutral as well, though I think it actually subdues saturation, as opposed to capturing it naturally.

    If you really want neutrality and accuracy at its finest, try some Fuji T64 in tungsten illumination. The only thing I like just as much for these purposes (though daylight balanced) is EPN.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

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  7. #27
    Athiril's Avatar
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    Depends how you light and expose.

    I've seen very natural and lovely looking portraits done on a Velvia.



    Astia 100f is definately one of the favourites though.

    Apparently Rollei Digibase CR200 has the most neutral greys though, apparently.

  8. #28
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ntenny View Post
    When my dad was in the camera business, he saw some actual research---I think it was published and everything---that found that, in (very) general, Fuji's colour films were deemed more realistic than Kodak's by Japanese viewers, and the reverse by American viewers. (I don't remember if it was specific to either print or slide.)

    So I think you're saying that the British are more Japanese than they are American? :-)

    Personally, I find Provia 100F to be nicely realistic, but everyone has their own taste in these matters. People really do perceive colours differently.

    -NT
    Well at one time slide films were aimed at different markets, and Fuji messed up when they launched a film for the US market that was very poorly received.

    I think there was a different perception amongst the US population as a whole about what was "good colour", but this came more from expectations because of what people saw in magazines, on the TV etc, often of a poorer quality to Europe and Japan, and not forgetting films were much worse in the pre E6/C41 days.

    In Europe and Japan it was the Fuji E4 films that really made big inroads, less contrasty than Ektachrome with an ability to handle greens well which Ektachrome struggled with.

    It was Fuji 50D & 100D that really set the modern standard of colour fidelity.

    Ian

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    I think there was a different perception amongst the US population as a whole about what was "good colour", but this came more from expectations because of what people saw in magazines, on the TV etc, often of a poorer quality to Europe and Japan, and not forgetting films were much worse in the pre E6/C41 days.Ian
    IMHO TV has a lot to answer for in forming people's perception of what represents "good" colour. With the advent of colour TV in the UK, the public were stumping up a lot of extra money for a) the receiver and b) the license, so by God they wanted their money's worth out of that "colour" control. When I used to do occasional domestic TV work for friends and relatives, they would usually be grateful for the fact that I'd resurrected their dead set but often qualify their gratitude with a comment along the lines of "shame about the colour", which I'd previously set to "natural" using the facial tones. Next time I'd see the set, there would be Reginald Bosanquet or Parky with a face like a beetroot and the colour control hard against the endstop.

    .....All of which is a long way round the houses of saying that we have to be careful when considering any opinions of what is "natural" colour ... including mine!

    Steve

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by ntenny View Post
    When my dad was in the camera business, he saw some actual research---I think it was published and everything---that found that, in (very) general, Fuji's colour films were deemed more realistic than Kodak's by Japanese viewers, and the reverse by American viewers. (I don't remember if it was specific to either print or slide.)

    So I think you're saying that the British are more Japanese than they are American? :-)
    Or maybe that the lighting in Japan is more similar to that in the UK than that in the US. At least if we are talking about the Western US, with its bright sunshine and low humidity.

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