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  1. #21
    Dan Henderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Griz View Post
    Hi Dan, Photobucket is back online, so here is the scan of the base exposure that I mentioned:

    Griz: My first thought was that if this is through just the soft contrast filter it might be too much, since the dog's back and parts of the tree trunk are pretty dark. BUT, maybe you needed this much to get tone in your son's face and his hat, which was probably the most important highlight area. And, if this soft exposure gave you the second print in your original post (along with, of course, a hard exposure) I'd say you were right on. I think that print has a good contrast. Highlights are nice and bright, shadows are good and solid.


    web site: Dan Henderson, Photographer.com

    blog: https://danhendersonphotographer.wordpress.com/

    I am not anti-digital. I am pro-film.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Henderson View Post
    Griz: My first thought was that if this is through just the soft contrast filter it might be too much, since the dog's back and parts of the tree trunk are pretty dark. BUT, maybe you needed this much to get tone in your son's face and his hat, which was probably the most important highlight area. And, if this soft exposure gave you the second print in your original post (along with, of course, a hard exposure) I'd say you were right on. I think that print has a good contrast. Highlights are nice and bright, shadows are good and solid.
    Hi Dan, thanks much for taking the time to compare the prints, and for your thoughts. My son's face, and his florescent orange hat were indeed the hardest parts to get tone into. My son was almost ghost white in real life (video games at that time in his life....ha!), and the direct sunlight almost made him glow! Getting good detail into the dog's coat was a challenge too, being tri-colored. Balancing the black and white, and trying to keep a degree of detail in both was a fun exercise.

    All the best, and thanks again,
    Griz
    Get out and shoot!!!

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by silveror0 View Post
    Just try controlling the lighting in landscape photography.
    In Arles (southern France) I pointed out a postcard to a shopkeeper who was embarassed about it, presumably I was the zillionth person to comment. There were a couple of bulls with hard sunlight from top right, while in the background a pink setting sun filled the left of the sky . . . Going to the trouble of taking along a spare sun to photograph a couple of cows shows serious landscape-lighting control by the photographer !

  4. #24
    Dan Henderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MartinP View Post
    In Arles (southern France) I pointed out a postcard to a shopkeeper who was embarassed about it, presumably I was the zillionth person to comment. There were a couple of bulls with hard sunlight from top right, while in the background a pink setting sun filled the left of the sky . . . Going to the trouble of taking along a spare sun to photograph a couple of cows shows serious landscape-lighting control by the photographer !
    Hey, I just saw a picture in a mountain biking magazine that guy must have also taken: 2 bikers are cutting through a tight turn. The second rider's bike is throwing a shadow on both sides of the bike. One shadow is distinctly darker than the other. I'm thinking a main sun and a fill sun.


    web site: Dan Henderson, Photographer.com

    blog: https://danhendersonphotographer.wordpress.com/

    I am not anti-digital. I am pro-film.

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Henderson View Post
    Hey, I just saw a picture in a mountain biking magazine that guy must have also taken: 2 bikers are cutting through a tight turn. The second rider's bike is throwing a shadow on both sides of the bike. One shadow is distinctly darker than the other. I'm thinking a main sun and a fill sun.
    Reminds me of when I was growing up (not the same thing as maturing) watching Lone Ranger movies on b&w TV with the family, and commenting on the double shadows of equal darkness during the "evening" camp scenes - an obvious studio setup. My dad said "who would ever notice such a thing?" Don't know for sure if that's what caused him to give me my first camera for a graduation gift, or if it was just so he could get his little folding Kodak back (616 film IIRC). Oh, and also the old western horseback chases done midday with gross underexposure to simulate moonlight scenes - ah, those were the days.

  6. #26
    Dan Henderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silveror0 View Post
    Reminds me of when I was growing up (not the same thing as maturing) watching Lone Ranger movies on b&w TV with the family, and commenting on the double shadows of equal darkness during the "evening" camp scenes - an obvious studio setup. My dad said "who would ever notice such a thing?" Don't know for sure if that's what caused him to give me my first camera for a graduation gift, or if it was just so he could get his little folding Kodak back (616 film IIRC). Oh, and also the old western horseback chases done midday with gross underexposure to simulate moonlight scenes - ah, those were the days.
    Didn't I read or hear somewhere that they used really strong red filters when shooting "night" scenes during the day?


    web site: Dan Henderson, Photographer.com

    blog: https://danhendersonphotographer.wordpress.com/

    I am not anti-digital. I am pro-film.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Henderson View Post
    Didn't I read or hear somewhere that they used really strong red filters when shooting "night" scenes during the day?
    Could be, but if the full filter factor were applied I doubt it would give that appearance. Using a partial filter factor might do it, but that would be underexposure. Using ortho film with red filter might work though.

    p.s. Sorry about hijacking the OP's thread. I'll behave now.

  8. #28
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    This picture will likely not print very well with just a straight shot of high contrast filtration and low contrast filtration respectively.

    The contrast of the scene is fairly high, and there's not detail in the hottest highlights, as well as the darkest shadows, which means the negative was underexposed and overdeveloped.

    So, you must employ the full strength of the split grade printing technique, and take advantage of the fact that you can burn and dodge at different contrast filtration. This is the true strength of printing this way, and if you're anything like I am, I sometimes use three different filters for my burning to get it just right.
    And, I must disagree that the high contrast filter has little to no effect on highlights - it can have a very dramatic effect. Especially in something like an overcast sky, for example, to create texture in those areas, to accentuate the small differences in tone that may be present there.

    Good luck!
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bertilsson View Post
    This picture will likely not print very well with just a straight shot of high contrast filtration and low contrast filtration respectively.

    The contrast of the scene is fairly high, and there's not detail in the hottest highlights, as well as the darkest shadows, which means the negative was underexposed and overdeveloped.

    So, you must employ the full strength of the split grade printing technique, and take advantage of the fact that you can burn and dodge at different contrast filtration. This is the true strength of printing this way, and if you're anything like I am, I sometimes use three different filters for my burning to get it just right.
    And, I must disagree that the high contrast filter has little to no effect on highlights - it can have a very dramatic effect. Especially in something like an overcast sky, for example, to create texture in those areas, to accentuate the small differences in tone that may be present there.

    Good luck!
    Hi Thomas, yep, still lots of room for improvement to my work prints, which is fine with me, I need the practice! These negs were the result of a perfect storm of obstacles. P&S camera, direct sunlight, heavy shadows, very light skinned subject, tri-colored hound, and the list goes on. I wasn't processing my own negs back in '95 when these were taken. The local "pro" shop developed the negs, and I had them do a 5x7 print for me. VERY disappointing results, with the highlights completely blown, so now that my own darkroom is up and running, it was the perfect opportunity to try to improve some prints, learn some new techniques, and have some fun, all at the same time!
    Thanks for your response. I'll be sure to post some new scans when I manage to complete a couple of final prints.

    Cheers!
    Griz
    Get out and shoot!!!

  10. #30

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    Yeah ... if you expose and develop everything correctly, you shouldn't need to split-print. Shouldn't
    need to dodge/burn either, or change you f-stop. Just politely ask the sun to maintain the correctly
    ligthing ratio for you every time. And while you're at it, make sure the scene illumination compensates for the illumination falloff of your enlarger bulb, diffuser, and lens. Real simple. Yeah,
    sure.

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