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  1. #1
    teekoh's Avatar
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    Same tray of water for stop and final rinse?

    Hi I'm new to black and white printing and was wondering is it a bad idea to use the same tray of running water for a "stop" and for a rinse after fixing an image if the water is constantly running?

    Thanks.

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    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Not a good idea and it's advisable to use a stop bath for prints as there's far more carry over, you ideally want the developer neutralised.

    Ian

  3. #3
    ROL
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    I'm assuming that you are primarily concerned with conserving space in your sink. People do, and are advised by some manufacturers to, use a "running water" stop, before fixing. If you can ensure a complete exchange of water, which can be quite different from running water, I think it at least theoretically feasible to use the the same tray for both. Some amount of testing may be advisable if your looking for some archival standard. But, I recall fill and dump of chemicals in trays in short space processing as being an available option many years ago.

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    David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    Consider stacking your trays, if you need more space. Housewares stores sell things like expandable stainless steel racks for more efficient use of cabinet space, and they can work well for stacking two 11x14" trays.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
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  5. #5
    teekoh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    Not a good idea and it's advisable to use a stop bath for prints as there's far more carry over, you ideally want the developer neutralised.

    Ian
    Hi Ian, I'm using Photographers Forumlary's TF-4 non-hardening fixer and on the label it says to just use water as a stop.

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    teekoh's Avatar
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    Thanks for the tips on stacking the trays that is a brilliant idea that hadn't crossed my mind. For both the water/stop and the final rinse do both these trays need to have running water? The situation is I have one faucet in the sink and one in the tub but to carry a print from the sink to tub would be awkward and over the course of a darkroom session might result in drippage of fixer on the small bathroom floor where I am constantly moving.

  7. #7
    teekoh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ROL View Post
    I'm assuming that you are primarily concerned with conserving space in your sink. People do, and are advised by some manufacturers to, use a "running water" stop, before fixing. If you can ensure a complete exchange of water, which can be quite different from running water, I think it at least theoretically feasible to use the the same tray for both. Some amount of testing may be advisable if your looking for some archival standard. But, I recall fill and dump of chemicals in trays in short space processing as being an available option many years ago.
    I bought a print washer with a tube that connects to my faucet which has water running into the tray on one end and holes on the opposite end for water to escape. Would that be considered a complete exchange?

  8. #8
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teekoh View Post
    Hi Ian, I'm using Photographers Forumlary's TF-4 non-hardening fixer and on the label it says to just use water as a stop.
    It's even more important to use a stop bath with a neutral/alkali fixer and paper as you run a far higher risk of dichroic fogging and staining compared to using a slightly acidic fixer. TF-4's buffered to cope with any carry over from a stop bath.

    Ian

  9. #9
    MattKing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teekoh View Post
    I bought a print washer with a tube that connects to my faucet which has water running into the tray on one end and holes on the opposite end for water to escape. Would that be considered a complete exchange?
    Stack that washer over your stop tray, and have the washer drain into the stop tray.

    The very tiny amount of residual fixer that might flow out of the washer tray won't hurt anything.

    Just be sure that the water doesn't also get in your developer or dilute the fixer.

    EDIT: Or alternatively use stop bath, as Ian indicates. I could be wrong, but as I understand it the instructions for TF-4 indicate that stop bath is unnecessary, not that it is prohibited.
    Matt

    “Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”

    Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2

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    Matt and Ian are correct you can use an acid stop with TF-4.

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