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  1. #1

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    cure for (thick) neg scratches...

    I have read older threads the other day to figure out how I should approach to this problem, but I've been very unsuccessful doing what's been said.

    I'm using a condenser-head enlarger with a Nikon lens and making a 8 1/2 x 12 9/16" sized prints with 35mm negs on AGFA FB. I like this setting and want to keep using it as much as I can. My developer is Ilford MG paper developer, and I use the 1:14 dilution.

    But one of my old negs originally had a few scratches on the non-emulsion side, so I greased it with, noseoil, "No Scratch" fluid, vaseline, etc. No of them really produced any better result. I soaked the neg in warm water and let the scratches to close by themselves, but that made the scratches bigger, thicker, and deeper; now they are more like cuts. There's a possibility that I must have mishandled it while doing that, but it's too late. So, back to the grease method, I also printed with a wider F stop, as wide as F2.8 and used a real short exposure time like five seconds, but that didn't solve the problem.

    Now, if there's another method that I can use before moving onto a diffuser-head enlarger as the last resort (because when I used it the last time it didn't give me any satisfying result for the contrast and the grainy texture on the print), what is it that I can still do? Am I still missing something that I need to know?

    Please help me out if you have any suggestions. Spotting is always a choice that I want to avoid as much as I can.

  2. #2
    David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    Retouching the print is likely the only analog solution other than reshooting.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
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  3. #3

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    The only thing I can think of is to make a print and hang it on the wall to be a reminder that sometimes you can't unring a bell.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by firecracker
    I have read older threads the other day to figure out how I should approach to this problem, but I've been very unsuccessful doing what's been said.

    I'm using a condenser-head enlarger with a Nikon lens and making a 8 1/2 x 12 9/16" sized prints with 35mm negs on AGFA FB. I like this setting and want to keep using it as much as I can. My developer is Ilford MG paper developer, and I use the 1:14 dilution.

    But one of my old negs originally had a few scratches on the non-emulsion side, so I greased it with, noseoil, "No Scratch" fluid, vaseline, etc. No of them really produced any better result. I soaked the neg in warm water and let the scratches to close by themselves, but that made the scratches bigger, thicker, and deeper; now they are more like cuts. There's a possibility that I must have mishandled it while doing that, but it's too late. So, back to the grease method, I also printed with a wider F stop, as wide as F2.8 and used a real short exposure time like five seconds, but that didn't solve the problem.

    Now, if there's another method that I can use before moving onto a diffuser-head enlarger as the last resort (because when I used it the last time it didn't give me any satisfying result for the contrast and the grainy texture on the print), what is it that I can still do? Am I still missing something that I need to know?

    Please help me out if you have any suggestions. Spotting is always a choice that I want to avoid as much as I can.
    Since scratches would render black on the print, I would retouch the neg. This will make the scratches go to white on the print so that you can retouch them.

    The other option of bleaching the dark scratches on the print is more difficult in my experience.

    Another option is to use a needle inserted in a pencil eraser and then very subtley and lightly etch the scratch on the negative. this will cause light scatter and cause the scratch to be less noticeable.

    Another idea is to use diffusion material below your condensers and above the negative...this will effectively convert your condenser enlarger into a diffusion enlarger for this one negative.

    Anything you try as far as retouching on 35 mm will be more difficult because of the small negative size. I would probably use diffusion first...Duratrans is a good diffusion material

  5. #5
    blansky's Avatar
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    Sometimes printing with the neg wet will work.

    Otherwise retouch it.


    Michael
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  6. #6
    Mike-D's Avatar
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    Edwal used to make a product called "No Scratch" which was a thick liquid that you coated the neg with. Glycerine also works very well. Its very thick and clear, a lot more effective than noseoil or vaseline. Fills the scratches nicely iirc.

    Mike D

  7. #7
    Charles Webb's Avatar
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    Wrong, if the scratches are on the base or non emulsion side they will be white in the print! Only a sctatch in the emulsion will print black!

    The glycerine or vasolene should work just fine if applied properly! Most likey some work will still be necessary on the print. A diffusion/coldlight enlarger and a wide aperature on the lens would also be an aid in printing this type of negative!



    Charlie.....

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald Miller
    Since scratches would render black on the print, I would retouch the neg. This will make the scratches go to white on the print so that you can retouch them.


    The scratches are on the non-emlusion side, not the shinny emlusion side, and that produces white marks on the prints.


    The other option of bleaching the dark scratches on the print is more difficult in my experience.

    Another option is to use a needle inserted in a pencil eraser and then very subtley and lightly etch the scratch on the negative. this will cause light scatter and cause the scratch to be less noticeable.

    Another idea is to use diffusion material below your condensers and above the negative...this will effectively convert your condenser enlarger into a diffusion enlarger for this one negative.


    Thank you for your advice. You mean to insert a it in where sheet filters go in on the enlarger head? Could you name any good diffusion material (brand-name products, etc) for that?


    Anything you try as far as retouching on 35 mm will be more difficult because of the small negative size. I would probably use diffusion first...Duratrans is a good diffusion material

    What's "Duratrans"? Is it widely available? Or is there any substitute for that? I'm in a Japanese market right now.

  9. #9

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    Thank you very much for your posts with your inputs. But it seems there's a little misunderstanding on the problem I stated in the beginning of this thread, so I have write it again.

    What I have on my neg is a few scratches that have produced white scratch marks on my prints. The scratches on the neg are pretty big, thick and deep, and they are on the non-emlusion side (non-shinny side); they are more like tiny dints. The cure attempts I made with noseoil, "No-Scratch(similar to Edwal product), and Vaseline have all failed. Between each session, I soaked the neg in warm water to heal, but I didn't seee any major improvement on the finished prints.

    From what I understand of the use of "No-Scratch" liquid (and according to its instruction), you can use it on the emlusion side because it faces up, but not on the ones on the non-emlusion side which faces down, and that's where the scratches are. So, when I applied it, I rubbed with my finger on the neg like any other types of grease, so the liquid was not going to drip. But that effect was almost like any other types of grease after all. Or maybe there's a smarter way to do that I still don't know.

    I have heard of the use of a diffusion material on a condenser-head enlarger before to covert it into a temporary diffuser-head, but I'm not sure exactly how to do it. Could anyone please elaborate a little more on this? Is there such a photo supply or an offical piece of equipment that's sold in a store? Or is this a DIY type of invention that some people do? I'm sure this type of information would be beneficial to everyone because certain popular enlargers both old and new are condenser heads (whether you can swap the heads or not).

    I know I have to make some compromise somewhere. I'm thinking of retouching the prints rather than using a diffusion-head enlarger in order to keep the consistent quality with grain texture and so on. But I still want to inquire all the necessary information and acquire the best technique to apply to solve this problem.

    Anyway since last night after leaving my darkroom, I was catching a cold, and today/tonight, I'm physically not in any good shape with play with fun chemicals. So, there's going to be a little down time for me, at least a day or two, and I can prepare for the next time. I have read the previous threads on APUG, and I think I've covered pretty much everything that's mentioned.

    So if you have more ideas and know the techniques to solve this problem, please post here!

    Firecracker

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Webb
    Wrong, if the scratches are on the base or non emulsion side they will be white in the print! Only a sctatch in the emulsion will print black!

    The glycerine or vasolene should work just fine if applied properly! Most likey some work will still be necessary on the print. A diffusion/coldlight enlarger and a wide aperature on the lens would also be an aid in printing this type of negative!



    Charlie.....
    How do you apply the grease(s) to the scratches/dints on the non-emlusion side properly? I used my fingers and rubbed it on the neg just like I do with my noseoil. The problem is the damage is on the side that faces down, so if it's too liquidly, it'll start to drip.

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