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  1. #1
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    Marshall's Photo Coloring System...colorize B&W?


    I got these color dyes at a garage sale. I don't do color darkroom so I was going to sell them but I was wondering if they could be used to colorize black-and-white prints. The instructions mention briefly using them on black-and-white prints but don't elaborate. I know people colorize prints but I have always heard of people using pencils.

  2. #2

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    They're the same color dyes that color prints are made with. You can spot color prints with them or colorize b&w white prints. The colors are worked into the emulsion layer, combining with it, not painted on top. You mix the colors the same way you would with a color head when making color prints (CYM). The color is built up gradually, similar to doing a water color painting - large areas are colored with a wash. It's not reversible but you can reduce, or delete, somewhat with ammonia. You can also neutralize a color by adding its complimentary color, I think, and make Grey. It's delicate work, I tried it with little success, but I gave up too easy. I've seen prints colored that way by those who mastered the technique and they looked magnificent. The company that made SPOTONE (Retouch Methods Co. Inc) also sold a set - the one I have.
    Last edited by panastasia; 05-03-2009 at 10:51 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    "Pictures are not incidental frills to a text; they are essences of our distinctive way of knowing." Stephen J. Gould

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    Some tips on how to do it can be found at the following links:

    http://www.essortment.com/all/handcolorblack_rqnq.htm

    http://www.atplayphotography.com/process.htm
    Frank Schifano

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    They are not the same color dyes that color prints are made of. Sorry PAN.

    The only dyes that are compatible with color prints are Kodak Retouching Dyes. AFAIK, Kodak made 3 sets. One was for Dye Transfer, one was for Flexicolor and the third was for Ektacolor. These sets had to be updated every time the papers were updated. The Marshalls retouching pencils will not fade at the same rate as a normal color print and therefore in about 10 or so years, the retouching marks will become evident.

    OTOH, to answer the main question, Marshalls coloring pencils are excellent for coloring B&W prints.

    PE

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    OTOH, to answer the main question, Marshalls coloring pencils are excellent for coloring B&W prints.
    Marshall's also makes oils for coloring photos. IMHO, I think they work better than the pencils.
    I don't know the product shown in the OP, but why not try them.

  6. #6
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    Bethe;

    My mother loved to oil paint and did some very fine paintings and photos, as did my aunt with straight oil paints. My mother also did a lot of coloring of my early work in both oils and pencil using the Marshalls products. I totally agree with you, both are fine products.

    PE

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    They are not the same color dyes that color prints are made of. Sorry PAN.

    The only dyes that are compatible with color prints are Kodak Retouching Dyes. AFAIK, Kodak made 3 sets. One was for Dye Transfer, one was for Flexicolor and the third was for Ektacolor. These sets had to be updated every time the papers were updated. The Marshalls retouching pencils will not fade at the same rate as a normal color print and therefore in about 10 or so years, the retouching marks will become evident.

    OTOH, to answer the main question, Marshalls coloring pencils are excellent for coloring B&W prints.

    PE

    But here's a quote from the instruction sheet for color print retouching colors offered by the SPOTONE/Retouch Methods Co, Inc:

    "Though these colors have been designed for use with the Ektacolor and Eastman color print papers they can be used with the same confidence on other color prints made with the color papers of other manufacturers."

    "...They will penetrate into the emulsion, becoming a part of it and leave no surface residue. The retouching and corrections will be invisible."


    I assumed they were similar to Marshalls. And Kodak Retouching Dyes for that matter. I've used them to colorize B&W prints, unsuccessfully. I'm not good at it, I don't have the patience.

    There's a masterfully done still life B&W photo colorized by an artist named Clint Eley, using retouching dyes, found in the book: Handtinting Photographs; by Judy Martin & Annie Colbeck. He spent two weeks on it.

    I've done much work with the oils and pencils on restored photos, people pay double for it. Not for the ones done with photoshop - no FB paper.
    Last edited by panastasia; 05-05-2009 at 09:06 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    "Pictures are not incidental frills to a text; they are essences of our distinctive way of knowing." Stephen J. Gould

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    Spotone and similar products are not meant for the same purpose as Marshall's photo oils. The former are meant for spotting out small imperfections like dust spots, small scratch marks, and the like. Marshalls photo oils are meant to hand color the print. Two different applications. Here's an example of something I did with a similar product. It's not a great photo, to be sure. As a proof of concept thing, it illustrates the point that it can be done.
    Last edited by fschifano; 06-30-2010 at 02:50 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    Frank Schifano

  9. #9

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    Frank,
    It can be done by both methods and a few others. Photo oils are actually very easy to apply, I'm sure you know. It's my preferred method because of the permanence. As PE said, the retouch dyes will fade over time just as color photos do because of there unstable nature.

    Nice colors! What paper did you use?

    Paul

  10. #10
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    There are several methods of retouching color photos and hand painting or coloring B&W photos.

    The retouching dyes or colorants are blends to match the dyes used in color papers and films and in the case of Kodak dyes, are revised for each version of product so that they match well in all regards. The oils and pencils used for coloring B&W prints are a different product line but may contain many of the same colorants.

    If you note in Paul's post above the product names are given and are quite old. If it were a newer product it would probably note that they match Endura or CA papers. The retouching dyes, as I noted, if not matched will shift color with illuminant and fade differently giving the print a spotty look. There would be no problem if used on a B&W print AFAIK, as it would just act like any other applied dye for retouching but being color would be subject to fade.

    PE

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