Cross Processed Negs + Enlarging In Color Help

[filmnut]

Tim;
Sorry, but that's what I meant by "film base". I should of been more specific, this would be unexposed, processed C-41 film. I would put it above the neg carrier, on the top of the diffusor, so that any dust or scratches wouldn't show. This was quite easy to do on the Durst's that I used at the time, but on other enlargers it might be more difficult.
Film base seems to help more in some situations, than in others, but if you can get the colour on the print that you want without it, so much the better.
Keith

[jd callow]

My durst head (cls 501) has a filter built in that is an approximation of the developed unexposed film base (~50y 50m). It was useful when I was running out of y or m.

[fiducio]

Thanks for all the help guys! I don't have a place in my house to have an enlarger, or to develop paper either for that matter. I have to go to SF and rent a darkroom. They have all Durst heads there, and all dichroic. The dials as usual, and not much else. I can go process a section of unexposed 120 film for the time being until I make it back friday. Experiment more, and get back to this post with my results. Should I post my results from my last session on this board so you can see what I'm dealing with exactly?
I can include a scan of a negative that's still negative too, so we can gauge film base color.

[jd callow]

Yes Post images.

[fiducio]

That's my negative, it's a fairly transparent mask, very slight purple hue.



That's it colors inverted with white balance in photoshop, no touch ups, made the mask color my pure black.



That was my print @ C=40, M=0, Y=25

[fiducio]

I know, I touched the forbidden Cyan...
Ultimately, what I really want to do is to make color prints from Black and Whites using appropriate filters and enlarger settings...

[2F/2F]

As you can see by inverting the colors in a computer, the neg will be easy to balance. Right now, your neg has a red cast, which translates to cyan on the print. It is not a really bad cyan cast, however. The print you got was to be expected at 0Y/0M. In fact, I am surprised that the orange cast was not even heavier with no filtration.

I am curious about the orange mask thing myself. (I asked as much in another thread recently.) I have never used one, but I have never been after somewhat "normal" color when cross processing until recently. I am wondering if it might help.

[fiducio]

I'll go give it a try, I'm about to throw some old BW400CN film straight into fixer to go get my filter ready. :]
So adding cyan to make it c=10 or c=xx amount, it's subtracting cyan, or adding it?

[2F/2F]

Whatever you do to the filter pack, you are doing the opposite to the print. Adding cyan has the same effect as subtracting equal amounts of yellow and magenta. That idea of filters having the opposite effect is as basic as it gets with color negative printing. Perhaps you should take a color printing class at a local school before going any farther with this...or at least browse through a textbook like Henry Horenstein's "Color Photography - A Working Manual", which is very cheap if you look around online. You will gain a lot of information and theory, and get it all in an organized (and much more quick and complete) fashion that way, instead of picking up bits and pieces on the Internet only as they apply to your immediate situation. If you don't have a handle on standard color neg printing, you don't stand much of a chance in hell of being able to get what you want with cross-processed negs.

[fiducio]

I did fine with my standard color neg prints, in fact, I did perfect on them. It took me 8 test strips, but once I was dialed in I blazed through them and got a lot done. Contact prints and all!
C=0, M=55, Y=55, was handwritten on the back of each print. I may be new, but I tend to learn and work fast.

I understand color, just not exactly how these dichroic heads work. And I know independently they work opposite of each other. So does that mean that in reverse they will produce RGB spectrum onto paper once it's printed and processed?

I'm 20, and in college. I've picked up a Hasselblad months ago, and now I'm in the darkroom, picking up knowledge from person to person and from books I'm picking up along the way. I love color, and I really would love to print color perfectly, no matter how much work it'll be.

So the basic model is that adding Cyan will give more Red, Magenta more Green, and Yellow more Blue, right?

And what I'm asking is when C=0, no Cyan is making it through from the head, right?

I'm sorry for sounding frantic and crazy, you all are providing lots of useful info, and I'm grateful. I am always trying to get more information than I can handle at once though. And maybe taking on too much as well. I know there's no exact formulas when it comes to the dark room, and all I'm doing is putting together a general guide for the next time I try this. But I'm actually happy for the fast responses, it's wonderful to see how many dedicated analog users there are still out there. :]