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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPablo View Post
    Sandy, if I'm not mistaken, isn't iron-blue toning nearly the same chemistry as cyanotypes? I thought the iron-blue toners were also potassium ferricyanide / ferric ammonium citrate based processes. As with cyanotypes, ferric ferrocyanide (aka Prussian blue) is the salt that produces the color. I understand that its aesthetic characteristics may differ as a UV-dependent contact process versus a toning process, but I don't understand why it should be any less archival than a cyanotype.

    http://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/Blue/blue.html
    Dr. Pablo,

    I really don't know anything about the archival properties of iron-blue toning of silver gelatin prints and did not mean to imply that I did. My remark about cyanotype was only meant to address the issue of the archival properties of true cyanotypes. As I said, my undestanding is that true cyanotypes are very archival, on par with palladium and platinum prints.

    Sandy

  2. #12
    DrPablo's Avatar
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    No problem, Sandy, I was just curious because I like using Berg Blue on occasion.
    Paul

  3. #13

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    Thanks for hijacking my thread, Dr Pablo

    Back to the question at hand for a second. What colors does platinum (or palladium) toning impart on silver prints ?

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPablo View Post
    Sandy, if I'm not mistaken, isn't iron-blue toning nearly the same chemistry as cyanotypes? I thought the iron-blue toners were also potassium ferricyanide / ferric ammonium citrate based processes. As with cyanotypes, ferric ferrocyanide (aka Prussian blue) is the salt that produces the color. I understand that its aesthetic characteristics may differ as a UV-dependent contact process versus a toning process, but I don't understand why it should be any less archival than a cyanotype.

    http://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/Blue/blue.html
    From the link you provided:

    "The bleached silver (silver ferrocyanide) certainly appears to be light stable, but if maximum permanence is important it must be regarded as a potential source of staining with exposure to light or atmospheric contaminants. A short, weak fix removes it...but also makes the colour brighter and more transparent and causes a small loss of image density."

    So it appears that blue-toning can be made archival -- but the article mentiones some issues with the re-fixing.

    I have whipped up a blue toner for students. It works well, but I have never compared it to other toners. The formula (T-12) is from the 1941 Elementry Photographic Chemistry, by Eastman Kodak Company. It is right above the formula for Uranium Mortanting and Toning!

    I would think that the biggest difference between a traditional cyanotype and a blue-toned silver print would be the surface of the print. The silver-based print having an emulsion (image contained in a layer of gelatin on the print surface) and the cyanotype's image being in the paper (not an emulsion).

    Vaughn

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Grenier View Post
    Thanks for hijacking my thread, Dr Pablo

    Back to the question at hand for a second. What colors does platinum (or palladium) toning impart on silver prints ?

    There may be more than one effect, but the silver prints that I have seen toned with palladium had a slightly warmer look than what one normally sees with silver.

    BTW, you might do a search on pt/pd toning of silver prints. There was a thread on the subject some time ago, more than a year as best I recall.

    I tone most of my kallitype prints (which are silver prints) with palladium. This changes the color from a warm chocolate brown to a more neutral brown black color, rather the opposite of what you get with a silver gelatin print.

    Sandy

  6. #16
    George Papantoniou's Avatar
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    I guess that Cyanotypes are considered archival because they're not affected by acids (like the ones that are formed by the air contaminants when they are mixed with humidity). They are very sensitive to Alkalis, though, so you must take care not to bring them in contact with any material that could contain alkaline substances.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by George Papantoniou View Post
    I guess that Cyanotypes are considered archival because they're not affected by acids (like the ones that are formed by the air contaminants when they are mixed with humidity). They are very sensitive to Alkalis, though, so you must take care not to bring them in contact with any material that could contain alkaline substances.
    Cyanotypes will indeed fade if in contact with alkaline substances. However, they can be restored by re-soaking in a slighlty acidic water bath. I have seen this done and it is pretty remarkable how the print regains its density.

    Sandy

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by sanking View Post
    There may be more than one effect, but the silver prints that I have seen toned with palladium had a slightly warmer look than what one normally sees with silver.

    BTW, you might do a search on pt/pd toning of silver prints. There was a thread on the subject some time ago, more than a year as best I recall.

    I tone most of my kallitype prints (which are silver prints) with palladium. This changes the color from a warm chocolate brown to a more neutral brown black color, rather the opposite of what you get with a silver gelatin print.

    Sandy
    Could one use the same toner with a silver print? Is it very expensive? Easy to make up? I have used gold and heard of platinum toner but only wrt centennial pop prints (Roger Hicks article). I would be curious as to the colour and archival effect too. Would be fun (unless it emptied my wallet).

    Tom

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Stanworth View Post
    Could one use the same toner with a silver print? Is it very expensive? Easy to make up? I have used gold and heard of platinum toner but only wrt centennial pop prints (Roger Hicks article). I would be curious as to the colour and archival effect too. Would be fun (unless it emptied my wallet).

    Tom
    Dear Tom,

    Yellowish, but astonishingly attractive with Centennial (far better than 'yellowish' implies). I keep meaning to buy some more platinum salts to tone Ilford MG WT. Will post results if ever I get around to it...

    Cheers,

    R.

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