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Thats not a bad idea, photographing a high resolution CRT or LCD monitor would be better, you would have a higher resolution filter, TV resolution is very low.
Originally Posted by holmburgers
Printing onto overhead transparency paper/film from an inkjet would be another way.
Anyway I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents that when I've been drying film and two wet pieces of C-41 have stuck to something or to glass and I've pulled them apart days later much of the layers go with it and rip off :P
So you might simply be able stick the wet processed film onto a b&w piece and let it dry.
Hey, thanks for the post. It's funny, as today I'm researching about reversal processing & preparing to buy the chemicals to try this out. Perhaps there's just something in the air today that says... *autochrome*
Letting the two films stick together like you mention is not a bad idea at all, especially for the final mounting/display step.
However, I have since revised my method outlined above with a significantly easier approach, assisted by a fellow APUGer who made some very helpful suggestions.
Namely, pin registration. This would eliminate the need to remove the AH backing as well as worrying about the b&w processing having any effect on the slide-reseau.
I still haven't taken the time to determine appropriate magnifications while photographing the TV screen, but here are some figures...
The starch grains of autochromes are said to be from 5-10 micrometers in size (.005-.01 mm) and a typical 24" CRT TV has pixels approximately (grossly approximate) 200 micrometers or .2 mms in size. So basically, I need about a 1:20 magnification, or is it 20:1? Regardless, that's easy math if I had the time & formulas in front of me, I digress. I'll be using a 180mm lens.
After I've gotten the slide-reseau processed (send away to a lab) I'm going to use a simple office hole-punch to "pin" register them. Once they're registered, tape them together securely and hopefully this sandwich will be thin enough to fit in a typical 4x5 film holder.
Figuring exposure should be easy... eventually I'll find a suitable ISO for the reversal processing & the filter-factor of the reseau can be determined simply by metering thru it. Likewise, changes in the original TV source will be important to standardize. Messing around with 'hue', 'tint', 'picture' and all that jazz found on some TV's could be very interesting and lead to a lot of flexibility, like producing a tungsten balanced reseau for instance, or creating a warmer/cooler reseau, etc.
Thanks for the bump and I hope to have results sometime (relatively) soon.
Last edited by holmburgers; 05-26-2010 at 02:55 PM. Click to view previous post history.
Using a resau technically puts you into the realm of Dufay Color, as that is how it was done.
And, to get a good resau, it is simple to print one onto a sheet of clear inkjet support using an inkjet printer with clear inks. I have seen a good transparency made by Mark Osterman at George Eastman House several years ago. He registered the resau with the film during exposure and then re-registered it again after processing. There was a tiny bit of color fringing IIRC due to expansion and contraction of the support. Estar would help.
Yes, that's a great point. I guess it is basically a dufaycolor, perhaps more so than an autochrome. And agreed that using an inkjet would be suitable, though I'd like to think that the slide film would produce purer colors & would be easier for me, who doesn't own a good inkjet printer.
However, the inkjet will be what I use in 50 years when slide film is all but discontinued.... can we even hope for 50 years??
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Well, this is the point then. Dufay is easy to reproduce and has been by many workers, but Autochrome is hard! It is then your choice as to which you want. But lets be sure that whichever way you go, lets use the right terms for it. I'm sure that either will turn out fine once one achieves the proper film and "filter package". I use this as a generic term for either method.
Since I've got your attention, could you tell me where the photo-emulsion was in relationship to the reseau and glass in an original autochrome plate? This has always puzzled me, as it seems like it would have to be sandwiched, thus making processing difficult.
Easy to do. Sheet of film/resau/ ! This sandwich was taped together in register using register pins to establish register through punch holes. Then these two sheets were placed in a holder and exposed with the resau towards the light source. The resau was smaller than the film to allow the film to fit in the holder.
After exposure, the two were separated and the film was processed. They were then remounted in register for projection. When I saw it, Mark had them as 2 sheets and he projected the B&W slide first then moved the resau over the film and you could see colors rainbow across subjects.
There is another method using 35mm where the resau is somehow mounted in front of the film but behind the focal plane shutter. In my opinion, this method would change the focal plane of the film.. The method I saw used sheet film which I believe was 4x5 or smaller.
I gave this some thought and a simple printing program in visual BASIC should accomplish making a fine resau. Marks was rather coarse.
I am thinking inkjet RGB and more inks - like rose bengal may be - to the paper.
Does its result be different than autochrome ?
Well, your resau would be R/G/B in a defined pattern, and inkjet R/G/B is quite good for an additive system so it should work.
Technically, it is not the random starch grains of Autochrome with that hue, it is just about exactly like Dufay. So, they will look subtly different.
That is about all I can say from a professional POV as a Photo System Design Engineer.