Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 70,002   Posts: 1,524,459   Online: 1035
      
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15
  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    298

    Where are the contrast filters supposed to go?

    I'm trying to hunt down some 6 inch VC filters, but have been offered the small 3.5 inch sheets.

    Is it ok to place them between the bottom condenser lens and the negative? Will that make all of the scratches on the filters visible because of the proximity?

    Or should they go above the first condenser lens?

    I don't want to save a couple of bucks and have artifacts in the prints.

    I am using the big D2 variable condenser.

  2. #2
    Ian Grant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    West Midlands, UK, and Turkey
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    16,221
    Images
    148
    That's the best place, above the condenser is far too hot and will burn them. Scratches shouldn't show up below, but my one set lasted about 20 yrs with no scratches anyway, as long as you careful they don't mark.

    Ian

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    5,231
    Images
    9
    If the filters are scratched now get new ones. If not scratched now, be nice to them, and under the lens is the best place for them. Makes it easier to split filter.
    Technological society has succeeded in multiplying the opportunities for pleasure, but it has great difficulty in generating joy. Pope Paul VI

    So, I think the "greats" were true to their visions, once their visions no longer sucked. Ralph Barker 12/2004

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    298
    Quote Originally Posted by mark View Post
    If the filters are scratched now get new ones. If not scratched now, be nice to them, and under the lens is the best place for them. Makes it easier to split filter.
    Under what lens? The lower condenser?

    Or do you mean under the projection lens (el Nikkor or similar)

    Just by logic, there shouldn't be anything between the negative and the paper, unless it's multicoated and made of optical glass.

    I also heard that scratches on the lower condenser do show up in prints. Wouldn't putting a scratched filter in there do the same thing?
    Last edited by Andrey; 01-29-2008 at 03:18 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  5. #5
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Montréal (QC)
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,351
    Images
    132
    Quote Originally Posted by mark View Post
    If the filters are scratched now get new ones. If not scratched now, be nice to them, and under the lens is the best place for them. Makes it easier to split filter.
    Under the lens is the worst place for filters that could be slightly damaged. It's OK if filters are A) gelatin and B) in good condition, but otherwise, it's much safer to put them between the negative and the condenser.
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

    My APUG Portfolio

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    298
    ok, I want to know what the manual says. I bet it says to put filters between the lamp and the top condenser lens.

    Otherwise, why would anybody make 6 inch filters?

  7. #7
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Montréal (QC)
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,351
    Images
    132
    Ilford makes 6inch VC filters. Very useful when you are printing 4x5 negatives.

    Isn't there a filter tray somewhere on the D2 ?
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

    My APUG Portfolio

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    298
    Quote Originally Posted by mhv View Post
    Ilford makes 6inch VC filters. Very useful when you are printing 4x5 negatives.

    Isn't there a filter tray somewhere on the D2 ?
    I can think of a couple of places where I could stick a filter.

    I can put it above the top condenser lens. I think that's the right way as it is before ALL of the optics.

    I can put it right on the negative carrier, above the negative. It doesn't seem right, but if the filter is 1mm above the neg, then it won't show up.

    Or I can stick it in anywhere between the neg and the paper. And that's one of the carnal sins of photography because the image gets degraded.

  9. #9
    rwyoung's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Lawrence, KS
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    704
    Images
    40
    Quote Originally Posted by mhv View Post
    Ilford makes 6inch VC filters. Very useful when you are printing 4x5 negatives.

    Isn't there a filter tray somewhere on the D2 ?
    Depends on the D2. Mine doesn't have a filter drawer. But sometimes I think it may have been built up from spare parts...
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things! http://rwyoung.wordpress.com

  10. #10
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Montréal (QC)
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,351
    Images
    132
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrey View Post
    I can think of a couple of places where I could stick a filter.

    I can put it above the top condenser lens. I think that's the right way as it is before ALL of the optics.

    I can put it right on the negative carrier, above the negative. It doesn't seem right, but if the filter is 1mm above the neg, then it won't show up.

    Or I can stick it in anywhere between the neg and the paper. And that's one of the carnal sins of photography because the image gets degraded.
    Well, the condenser are not exactly part of the image-forming optical system. Their function is to "equalize" the beam of light that comes from the bulb. The bulb is a small, widening light source, and the condensers make it a large, more rectilinear light source.

    So here's my theory: if you put the filters above the condensers, they will be unequally lit by the bulb, most importantly they will suffer from more direct heat and fade quicker. If you put them below the condensers, then you will light them with a more even source of light (i.e. more even fading over time), and the glass will protect a little bit your filters from the heat.

    But anyway, I'm sure if someone really made the test, he would come up with a 1% fading difference over a period of 20 years, give or take 0.5%... So just do what you want, and if it doesn't work, try something else!

    Good printing!
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

    My APUG Portfolio

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin