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  1. #11

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    if you're vigilant about dust, the AN glass carriers are a very good option. back to your bowing issue, never had that with my inserts. are they actually bent or are they not inserted properly ?

  2. #12
    Doc W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuhead View Post
    if you're vigilant about dust, the AN glass carriers are a very good option. back to your bowing issue, never had that with my inserts. are they actually bent or are they not inserted properly ?
    It is not the inserts which bend. If I hold the carrier by the front, it bows ever so slightly which means that the inserts can't keep a firm grip on the negative.

    Do you use a Devere? If so, I would love to hear more. I am on the verge of sending the carrier back which would be a shame if it is just a misunderstanding on my part.

  3. #13
    Ian David's Avatar
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    OK, here is a photo of my neg carriers, as requested. One is newer than the other, but they are both the same design. I am guessing even a new one bought today would be the same?

    There is naturally some play on the back hinge of the carrier. If you look at the hinge, you can see it has been designed that way. I presume this is so that the carrier will still function well with inserts of slightly different thicknesses. My inserts (top and bottom) look to be each 2mm thick = a total of 4mm. But the play in the hinge means that inserts of 1.5 or 2.5mm should also work. The thinner the inserts used, it is perhaps more likely that your negative might be able to move if you grab the carrier at the very front edge. Perhaps your inserts are a bit on the thin side - are they proper DeVere inserts or someone else's knock-off, do you know?

    In any case, I do not generally handle my carrier by the very front edge, but tend to hold it more by the left side (towards the front). However, I just did some experimenting and my negs didn't move even when I did hold by that front edge. If you do some playing around with it, you should be able to work out how best to hold your carrier so that there is always some pressure holding your neg steady. Also, I generally put the carrier down on a flat surface in order to load the neg into it in the first place. I do not pick it up until the carrier is closed.

    There are also four nipples on one of the inserts which insert into holes in the opposing insert. These also help hold neg strips in place. (I should say that I very rarely try to load a single 35mm or MF negative into the carrier. All my negs are in strips, so the carrier is generally gripping a strip of three MF frames. I imagine that a single 35mm or MF frame would have more chance of moving about.)

    Finally, as mentioned above, you can get AN glass inserts (which I often use for 5x4 sheets because it prevents any popping) and these seem to hold the negs well even without the nipples.

    Ian
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DeVere-neg-carrier.jpg  

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc W View Post
    Does yours not loosen its grip on the negative when you hold it by the front?
    I never have any problems with my 5x4 Negs moving after I have loaded them - where ever I hold the Carrier despite my Neg Carrier having a lot of slop in it.

    Martin

  5. #15
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    Ian, I have one of those holders but it doesn't fit my machine (a slightly later model). I have attached some pics of mine. I have really tried to make this work but it seems no matter where I hold it, it bows so that negative becomes loose.

    The only problem I have in using other holders is that they they don't click into place. I am thinking that I can use another holder and put a strip of aluminum block at the back and at the side so that the negative lines up properly.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_1460-b.jpg   IMG_1461-b.jpg  

  6. #16
    Ian David's Avatar
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    Hmmm, I haven't used a holder like yours, so cannot really comment. Maybe send Odyssey Sales (post 8 above) an email and explain your problem, and they may be able to shed some light on it. I bought my AN glass from them a few years ago and they were helpful. Good luck! I'll be interested to hear whether you manage to sort it out.

    Ian

  7. #17

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    Hey Doc,

    Those are the same holders as I've got. I don't have any issues with film sliding out from loose fit in the carrier,I can turn the carrier on it's side and the film stays put. To make sure the inserts are secure, you have to pull back slightly on the finger holes ( top and bottom) which will engage one edge of the insert. My 4x5 inserts also have three pins on one of the carrier inserts and matching holes on the opposite. These have to fit properly or else there's going to be some play which may or may not be the problem. Do you have photos of the inserts you bought ?

  8. #18
    Doc W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuhead View Post
    Hey Doc,

    Those are the same holders as I've got. I don't have any issues with film sliding out from loose fit in the carrier,I can turn the carrier on it's side and the film stays put. To make sure the inserts are secure, you have to pull back slightly on the finger holes ( top and bottom) which will engage one edge of the insert. My 4x5 inserts also have three pins on one of the carrier inserts and matching holes on the opposite. These have to fit properly or else there's going to be some play which may or may not be the problem. Do you have photos of the inserts you bought ?
    The inserts were in the other photos but probably a little hard to see. They fit in pretty tightly with no play whatsover, but when I grip the holder by either the front or the side, it loosens its grip on the negative. I have attached pics of the inserts both flat and from the side, so you can see the edge.

    When I look at the holder horizontally, the two halves do not fit together tightly. The gap is large enough that I can see right through. If I squeeze on the front, it makes it even more pronounced. It definitely does not hold the negative tightly in place.

    Btw, folks, I really appreciate the help with this. I don't know anyone locally with a similar enlarger. If there IS anyone reading this who lives in Ottawa and has the same enlarger and holder, I would love to see it for comparison.

    canuhead, I may be going to Toronto in the next few weeks. If KHB can hold off on the return of the holder, I would like to see yours first for comparison. If that is possible, send me a message.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_1463-b.jpg   IMG_1465-b.jpg  

  9. #19

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    for sure, let me know when yer coming down and I'll check to see what my sked is like.

    Is the gap with the inserts or w/o ? I'll take another looks at mine again.

    *******

    ok, when I look through the front edge (finger holes closest and inserts in) the left side is tighter and there's a very sliiight gap at right. Regardless the negs don't slide out if it I tip the carrier over towards the gap side. Without the inserts, the gap is same.

    Maybe take a straight edge and see if everything is square ?

  10. #20
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Doc W, I use the big brother of your carrier in my 10x8 enlarger, it's essentially identical except much larger so mre prone to problems.

    I agree with your comments but have got used to mine now and rarely have a problem, there's a knack to holding the carrier as you place it back in the enlarger, I lift mine from underneath hand either side.

    Ian

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