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  1. #21
    Marco B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wager123 View Post
    does anyone have the service information guide for the unit without the round connector in the plug that goes from the head to the power supply? i have it for the unit with the round pin in the plug.
    thanks
    mitch
    Mitch,

    What do you mean with "service manual"?

    Ilford posted PDFs on their website of manuals and some technical stuff like circuit diagrams. However, unfortunately, the available MG500 Operating Manual is for the MG 500 unit with 500C controller, while the available MG500 Exposure System Service Manual is the newer MG500 unit type with the 500CPM controller.

    If you are looking for the MG500 Exposure System Service Manual for a unit with the 500C controller with circuit diagrams for electronics repair, you are probably out of luck... I contacted Ilford directly about this, and they answered that they had nothing available, and all they had was available on their site...

    The "next best" thing I can offer you, is to have a look at an older APUG thread by myself, where I posted a scan of the 500C controllers electronics board, with the scanned circuit lines of the back of the board super-imposed in Photoshop, that gives some idea of how the unit is connected...

    The electronics circuit diagram of the 500S power supply as displayed in the manual for the MG500 system with 500CPM controller, shows only minimal changes compared to the 500S units with 500C controller, so is still usable if you know how to read circuit diagrams and interpret real electronics.

    Marco
    Last edited by Marco B; 12-28-2010 at 01:52 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    My website

    "The nineteenth century began by believing that what was reasonable was true, and it wound up by believing that what it saw a photograph of, was true." - William M. Ivins Jr.

    "I don't know, maybe we should disinvent color, and we could just shoot Black & White." - David Burnett in 1978

    "Analog is chemistry + physics, digital is physics + math, which ones did you like most?"

  2. #22
    Marco B's Avatar
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    Edit to above post: I noticed the link to the PDF with scans of the electronics board of the 500C controller in the other, older, thread by myself is dead. It is a link to a file on my own homepage. I must have screwed something up. I will have a look at home (currently at a public library typing this) and see if I can restore it, so you can have a look.

    Edit 2: Restored the file on my website, but I have now also added it as an attachment here.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Marco B; 12-28-2010 at 06:19 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    My website

    "The nineteenth century began by believing that what was reasonable was true, and it wound up by believing that what it saw a photograph of, was true." - William M. Ivins Jr.

    "I don't know, maybe we should disinvent color, and we could just shoot Black & White." - David Burnett in 1978

    "Analog is chemistry + physics, digital is physics + math, which ones did you like most?"

  3. #23
    Katie's Avatar
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    I would love your exposure probe, if you don't want it. I don't have that or a footswitch.

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco B View Post
    Hi Paul,
    In addition, the 7 flat, 1 round pin connectors, may be specific to the 500CPM controllers, as they function differently. If I remember it well (I don't have one), someone here on APUG mentioned the 500CPM controllers were specifically designed for split grade printing (0/5), while my 500C controller only has basic grade (0-5 in 1/2 grade increments) and time settings.

    But correct me if I am wrong on this last point...
    I can only speculate - and put up some more photos which may help people trying to identify controllers from fuzzy photos on eBay:







    Note that while the 500CPM has a separate power cable both controllers have the same sort of plug on the end and will connect to either power supply.

  5. #25

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    hi marco
    the manual with the diagrams is the service manual i have. so its for the newer unit with a cpm controler. i wanterd to compair the two as after takeing the two different plug heads off the color wires , even tho they use the same colors, are on different pins. thanks for all the links. i just have to hope someone has one.
    mitch
    mitch brown

  6. #26
    Marco B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wager123 View Post
    hi marco
    the manual with the diagrams is the service manual i have. so its for the newer unit with a cpm controler. i wanterd to compair the two as after takeing the two different plug heads off the color wires , even tho they use the same colors, are on different pins. thanks for all the links. i just have to hope someone has one.
    mitch
    Hi Mitch,

    Maybe this is a little bit of use. It shows the wire connections for the controller cable to the 500C controller and the respective voltages on some of the cables. See attachment.

    Marco
    My website

    "The nineteenth century began by believing that what was reasonable was true, and it wound up by believing that what it saw a photograph of, was true." - William M. Ivins Jr.

    "I don't know, maybe we should disinvent color, and we could just shoot Black & White." - David Burnett in 1978

    "Analog is chemistry + physics, digital is physics + math, which ones did you like most?"

  7. #27

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    hi marco
    thanks for the image. what i am trying to do is get a diagram of the 500 head to power supply connection .i have one head with all flat pins and one with 7 flat and 1 round. i have the wireing info for the one with the round pin but need one showing the wires of the plug with all flat pin.
    thanks all
    mitch
    mitch brown

  8. #28
    Marco B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wager123 View Post
    hi marco
    thanks for the image. what i am trying to do is get a diagram of the 500 head to power supply connection .i have one head with all flat pins and one with 7 flat and 1 round. i have the wireing info for the one with the round pin but need one showing the wires of the plug with all flat pin.
    thanks all
    mitch
    Mitch,

    Essentially, both the 500S power supply and the head have changed little, at least not in any significant way.

    The main differences between the circuit diagrams of the 500S power supply and head of the MG500 system with the 500CPM controller versus the ones with the 500C controller, seems to be that in the newer power supply two circuit boards are used (PCB1 & PCB2 in the circuit diagram of the power supply in the "MG500 Exposure System Service Manual") versus one in the older power supply for the 500C controller. However, the basic functioning of many of the components listed for the newer powers supplies circuit boards, are exactly the same as in the old one, and many of the IC (integrated circuits) model numbers match.

    In terms of changes to the head, it seems Ilford added an additional "door interlock" switch (SW1 in the circuit diagram of the enlarger head - fig 2.1 on p15 of the "MG500 Exposure System Service Manual") to cut out the high voltage connections to the head whenever you open the heads front panel. This is just a basic extra safety measure. In my older unit, I can open the head with the lamps burning.

    I don't think this last change affects the wiring schema to the head in any way, it is just an internal switch in the head itself if I am right, but you can check it in your heads.

    I basically wouldn't be too surprised if no real change in the wiring to the enlarger head has taken place... The main difference is in the two types of controllers, and how they interact with the power supply to switch and modulate the light output of the lamps.

    Looking from the fig 2.3, p17 diagram of the power supply in the Ilford service manual, SK2 denotes the socket of the enlarger head. Pins 5 & 6 are for the high voltage connections to the two lamps, allowing them to be switched. 1 (the rounded pin on the new units) is the ground. Pin 7 & 8 should be 120V AC, pin 2 30V AC, 4 is connected to the 0V and switches the cooling fan in the head by means of relay RL2/1. Relay RL1/1 switches the safe light. Both of these you can actually "hear" switching with a small tick if you listen carefully. Pin 3 seems unused...
    Last edited by Marco B; 12-30-2010 at 05:04 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    My website

    "The nineteenth century began by believing that what was reasonable was true, and it wound up by believing that what it saw a photograph of, was true." - William M. Ivins Jr.

    "I don't know, maybe we should disinvent color, and we could just shoot Black & White." - David Burnett in 1978

    "Analog is chemistry + physics, digital is physics + math, which ones did you like most?"

  9. #29

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    Marco thanks for the very detailed info. I have noticed that the fan in my head doesn't turn off but runs all the time . i would guess that the relay must be bad. do you think that the fact the fan runs all the time would cause a problem that must be fixed? if so how hard would this be? again thaks to everyone. this is the best site i have found and this kind of help from all is why i subscribe
    mitch
    mitch brown

  10. #30
    Marco B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wager123 View Post
    Marco thanks for the very detailed info. I have noticed that the fan in my head doesn't turn off but runs all the time . i would guess that the relay must be bad. do you think that the fact the fan runs all the time would cause a problem that must be fixed?
    I am not an electronics expert or so, but to me, the fan not turning off seems to be a negligible issue. The only reason I can think of that you might not wish to have it run all the time is the noise and possible diminished life time of the fan. But looking at computer fans, I guess the fan will keep running almost eternally...

    However, if it would break, you might have some trouble finding a replacement for this specific type of fan.

    By the way, much to my own surprise, in terms of real electronics repairs, it turns out that most of the components, even though designed and manufactured for the first time at the end of the '70s, are still being manufactured and can be bought through good electronics shops.

    I was actually astonished to learn this from a very helpful Dutch APUG member with good electronics knowledge, but it turns out these components are so generic, they still have use today and have probably had wide spread application in industrial equipment needing servicing for decades, hence they are still available to be bought new.

    This means that a true repair of even the more complicated (IC) components in the power supply or controller may be viable, if really necessary.

    But be careful before calling something "broken". I had issues with the start up of the controller and it going bezerk. Besides an easily fixed issue with the cable connecting it to the power supply, it also turned out the unit had issues with dampness. My bathroom doubles as darkroom, and even though I ventilated it well, the controller gave issues. Turns out that switching the MG500 including the controller on during showering each day, solves the issues completely!!! I guess, since the controller and power supply warm up during use and being on, no longer any tiny water film or dampness can form, allowing the unit to start up properly as it should.
    Last edited by Marco B; 12-30-2010 at 01:47 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    My website

    "The nineteenth century began by believing that what was reasonable was true, and it wound up by believing that what it saw a photograph of, was true." - William M. Ivins Jr.

    "I don't know, maybe we should disinvent color, and we could just shoot Black & White." - David Burnett in 1978

    "Analog is chemistry + physics, digital is physics + math, which ones did you like most?"

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