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  1. #1
    tcartpilot's Avatar
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    Linhof bellow replacement

    Hey Folks,

    Long time lurker, first time poster at this fantastic site.

    I have recently decided to make the jump into trying 4x5 and have come up with a Linhof Kardan Color 45S to play / learn with. It is in need of a new set of bellows (completely ripped) I can find a new set of bellows but in looking at the attachment frames the original (I think the original anyway) bellows were glued in with some sort of glue that appears to be pretty tough stuff.

    So the question is how do I get the old bellows off and the frames cleaned up and ready for the new bellows and what type of glue is used to reset the new bellows??

    I know that with some glues (woodworking is my experience) you can use mild heat from a hot iron to loosen glues. Will this work for this application??

    Eric
    Philomath,OR

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    Eric,

    I bought a used Linhof Tecknikardan from Scotland, knowing it had a bad bellows, in about 2004. I asked here and on the LF Forum where and how to get a new bellows before I made the purchase. The quote figured into the camera price. Most recommendations were for Camera Bellows in England, over Western Bellows Jim 7454 Henbane St. Etiwanda, CA 91739 (909) 980-0606 even though Western was closer.

    Camera Bellows quoted about $200 plus postage. If I remember correctly, a new bellows was about $560 from HP Marketing, the Linhof USA distributor. I don’t remember the postage cost, England to OH, USA, but it seemed quite reasonable. They said send the old bellows and frame in. I did and the new bellows came back on that frame. They solved the problem you are asking about and put on the new bellows. It worked beautifully for me through last summer when I sold the camera to a pro named Ari in Montreal, Canada on the LF Forum. That camera has traveled.

    My understanding is that Camera Bellows closed their doors some time after 2004, but the actual bellows builder reopened under a new name. “Custom Bellows” replaced “Camera Bellows” http://www.custombellows.co.uk/ That site seems to be working today.

    Good luck. Drop me a PM telling me how it works for you.

    John Powers
    "If you want to be famous, you must do something more badly than anybody in the entire world." Miroslav Tichı

  3. #3
    tcartpilot's Avatar
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    Thanks, John.

    I emailed them yesterday just before posting here. They responded today ( they're quick ) The price hasn't gone up much. $217+postage was they're quote and 6-8 weeks delivery time. Seems pretty fair given what they cost new.

    I had found a set on the 'bay for only $89 but after thinking about it and thinking of the quality and the fact they install them, I will probably go with Custom Bellows. I am not really in a hurry and there is lots of the rainy season left here in the pacific northwest for indoor playing with a new camera!! Still looking for a lens, film holders, and some other odds and ends anyway.

    By chance, do you have an idea of the length of these bellows? They requested the old bellows and frames for a pattern and mine only has a short piece attached to one end so I don't have the length measurement.

    Will certainly let you know how it all comes together,
    Eric

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    Eric,

    I no longer have Tecknikardan. Even so it is a different model from yours.

    I would suggest posting that specific question here and the LF Forum. Some one will have one and be able to measure. As an alternative, search for that camera. Something will probably turn up with the specs. If you are not familiar with LF, it would probably be called bellows draw.

    Good luck,

    John Powers
    "If you want to be famous, you must do something more badly than anybody in the entire world." Miroslav Tichı

  5. #5
    jp80874's Avatar
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    Eric,

    There was one listed at B&H. They no longer have it, but the specs were still on the site.

    Tilts Front and Rear Axis: 48° Forward and Backward
    Swings Front and Rear: 48° Leaft and Right, calibrated, 360° total, limited by bellows
    Rise & Fall Frontand Rear: 4.7" (120mm) Rise only
    Shifts Front and Rear: 1.8" (45mm) left and right
    Camera Back 4x5" 360° usable Revolving International Graflok
    Groundglass with black lines, 6x9,9x12cm and 4x5" markings
    Interchangeable Bellows Yes
    Minimum Extension With standard bellows and flat lensboard: 3.6"
    Maximum Extension 17.7" (449mm) with included monorail
    Lensboard Toyo 158x158mm
    Dimensions 19 x 11 x 14" (47.4 x 27.4 x 35.2 cm) LWH
    Weight 7 lbs 41.2 oz (3.58 kg)


    "Maximum Extension 17.7" (449mm)" is probably your bellows draw. That seems short though, because I could use a 450mm lens on the Technikardan. You would need a little more than 449mm for focusing.

    That is a ball park for a start. How much rail do you have? What size lenses do you have or want? Perhaps they could make it as long as you have rail. Just an idea. I made up a 60" three standard, two bellows set for a Sinar P 8x10 that I wanted to use for macro work. Decide what you want and go after it.

    John
    "If you want to be famous, you must do something more badly than anybody in the entire world." Miroslav Tichı

  6. #6
    tcartpilot's Avatar
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    John,

    I just measured the rail and it is 17.75" which would be 450mm. So I am guessing that it needs just a little more in case you want movements?? Ask for about 500mm length?

    Eric

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    Eric,

    http://www.shutterbug.com/content/cl...norail-classic nice general description

    This article implies 300mm lens limit
    http://www.lightmountainphotography....age%20tech.htm

    Extra bellows won’t help much if you can’t pull the standards further apart. 18” = 457.2mm

    I had forgotten that I own the book, “The Linhof Camera Story”. It lists details on each camera made.
    “Kardan Color 9x12 cm /4x5”
    Camera Type: Monorail view camera, successor to Linhof Color
    Made 1964 to 1975
    Special features: Base rail splits into 330mm and 120mm sections (useful for wide angle shooting and for portability with rapid screw connection. Back has 70mm vertical shift. Cutout at front of housing for easier front rise with wide angle lenses. Rotating back with swing/tilt frame. Hinged rail clamp. Lateral shift (40mm each way) on lens standard plus center tilt. No lateral shift on rear. Maximum extension 435mm.”

    Earlier in the book it refers to this model as the 20 year predecessor of the Technikardan. Greater bellows extension was seen as one of the improvements in the TK45.

    I would guess then that 500mm would simply be too much for the rail limitations. The bellows would be cramped up and limit your movement. 435mm-450mm would be lots of movement for a 300mm lens.

    Just to up the anti, if you want to shoot wide angle, you will probably also want a bag bellows. My TK45 had both by the time I was done.

    John
    "If you want to be famous, you must do something more badly than anybody in the entire world." Miroslav Tichı

  8. #8
    tcartpilot's Avatar
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    Ok.....so I think that I have this about figured out now.

    In doing research on the web, it would seem that these bellows are the same as the 'GT' bellows which I have found dimensions for length of 360mm. That got me to go back and measure the 45S again. Although I measured the rail as 17", the distance between the front and rear standards where the bellow frames attach is only 15" or 380mm. So I am thinking that the 360mm measurement must be correct.

    Thanks again John for your help,
    Eric



 

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