Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 70,294   Posts: 1,535,573   Online: 1101
      
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 30
  1. #11
    pstake's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    704
    Images
    64
    Quote Originally Posted by DesertNate View Post
    V(f)= Y x F / (N +D)

    Value (friendship) = Y (the number of years) x F (the friendship factor) divided by the sum of Nuisance and Drama.
    You left out the "free pizza and beer" vector!

    Thanks, everyone, for confirming the murkiness of this topic.

  2. #12
    Mainecoonmaniac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    2,963
    Images
    6
    If you're speaking about the business in the commercial realm, cost of prints are just incidental. Commercial photographers mainly make their money off fees and markups on prints just cover the incidentals of producing the print like running to the lab and handling prints. Here's a link to a book on business practices by ASMP. http://asmp.org/articles/professiona...ices-book.html

  3. #13
    Newt_on_Swings's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NYC
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,813
    I've given away prints for food and beer before actually haha. Maybe it's more of a trade but not implied. A sandwich shop by my work used to have two of my silver gelatin prints on the wall before they remodeled, got free beers for that one

  4. #14
    polyglot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    South Australia
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    3,226
    Images
    12
    I'm with the "it's completely free for friends at least once" brigade, after all what are friends for? Even with that approach, good people will often insist on paying something and I've received $100-200 on average for about 50% of my intended-to-be-free jobs. If they want to keep on having shoots and prints though, explain that they will have to pay cost-of-goods and be ruthless in adding everything to that cost that you will actually use (e.g. tell them it's petrol money plus $10/roll to shoot B&W plus $10 per delivered 8x10" (don't forget wastage, test strips & work-prints!); some simple price that covers your direct costs). Your labour cost is up to you; I still generally leave it at $0 for friends after charging them for materials but for more-distant acquaintances, I charge a nominal labour cost ($50/hour) that will scare off the time-wasters & riff-raff.

    You need a written contract specifying price, terms of delivery and most importantly, that you retain copyright and laying out the license that you grant with the prints you supply. Doesn't matter if it's your mother or brother or whatever as customer, rights need to be nailed down (duration, resale, sublicensing, replicas/backups, display, etc) precisely even if you're ultimately generous in what you grant.

    If they're strangers, you're competing with commercial studios so you have a responsibility to a) not kill your local businesses by undercutting them with free skilled labour and b) ensure you extract appropriate value from your commercial services, because you are at that point providing a commercial service. Such customers get the full billable rate ($100-150/hour; 30-40% of that will go to paying your overheads like building, vehicle, etc) and 100% markup on materials consumed. If they balk at the total quoted price, let them walk.

    People expect photos to be free these days. You don't need to play that game unless you want to be a sucker and/or philanthropist.
    Last edited by polyglot; 05-24-2012 at 12:15 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  5. #15
    Diapositivo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Rome, Italy
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    1,844
    I think the price is fair as far as the capture and developing is concerned. I have some problems with "photographing her family". Do you go there? They come to you? Your studio? Do you provide a lighting setup with multiple flashes, background etc. or do you just go to their place and take pictures?

    I have no idea how much time would it take to make a good print, but I think I would raise the price on prints.

    I wouldn't do this for free for a coworker. A friend is a friend, a collegue is a collegue. If the work is well received, you might receive other requests from the same client, or from other clients - other coworkers, other persons to whom you were referred by this client.

    So if I were you I wouldn't do it for a price for which you wouldn't do it many times. Price in a way that it might become a future activity for you (not necessarily your main one, but a pleasant second work).

    Especially don't do it for free. You'll find out that if you do it for free, you'll have difficulties even in finding them at home when you go there. And in any case "no good deed goes unpunished".

    Fabrizio
    Fabrizio Ruggeri fine art photography site: http://fabrizio-ruggeri.artistwebsites.com
    Stock images at Imagebroker: http://www.imagebroker.com/#/search/ib_fbr

  6. #16
    Worker 11811's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,620
    Oh... BTW...

    Think twice about providing a CD for free. You should charge for that if you provide it at all.
    That CD has value. That CD took work to make. But, moreover, that CD contains all your pictures in digital format.

    If you want to sell prints, the CD is going to work against you. Your client can now print off 1,000 copies on her inkjet printer, virtually for free. Why should she come back to you to get prints that cost $10 or $20 apiece?

    Providing a CD is a good service but, as I said, charge for it. (Like $50!)
    When you do provide it, make sure the images are SMALL. Like 300 pixels horizontally.
    You want pictures that she can look at on her screen or post on Facebook but you don't want her to be able to print out full size images that she could be coming back to you for.

    ALSO, put your name, address and copyright statement in the metadata! If she's going to post your pictures on Facebook (et. al.) you'll want your name attached to them. 99% of the people out there don't even know what metadata is, let alone how to strip your name out of it.

    You could put a visible watermark in the pictures or use a steganographic method like DigiMark or similar. That's up to you.

    Bottom line: Watch out when you provide a CD!
    Randy S.

    In girum imus nocte et consumimur igni.

    -----

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/randystankey/

  7. #17

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    5,035
    Quote Originally Posted by polyglot View Post
    I'm with the "it's completely free for friends at least once" brigade, after all what are friends for? Even with that approach, good people will often insist on paying something and I've received $100-200 ...
    That happened to me once (4-hour Sweet-16 party for a very spoiled girl). It was nice that they offered payment rather than asking for a freebee. The $200 they gave me was $100 less than they promised... but I felt good helping them out and they still (4 or 5 years later) compliment me on both the kind act and the nice photos.

  8. #18

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    5,035
    p.s. My friends even asked what film to provide, how much, and they did the processing themselves.

    Whether I would do that again is really a matter of how good the friendship is... or how much beer-and-pizza was offere, or how big their TV screen is. As Fabrizio said, "I wouldn't do this for free for a coworker. A friend is a friend, a collegue is a collegue."

  9. #19
    M.A.Longmore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    New York
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,847
    Images
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post
    p.s. My friends even asked what film to provide, how much,
    and they did the processing themselves.
    .
    If I was providing the photographic service, I would maintain
    ownership of the entire process. I would purchase the film,
    provide the processing service, and keep the negatives in my
    possession. I would never turn over the negatives, or an
    " Unmarked CD " of images to someone.

    Ron
    .
    Last edited by M.A.Longmore; 05-24-2012 at 11:37 AM. Click to view previous post history.

    __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________


    Sanjay Sen - APUG Subscriber
    Sanjay Sen, 36, a champion of human and animal rights, died June 3 in a motorcycle accident in Wayne, New Jersey.

    July 23 1975 - June 3 2012

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________

  10. #20

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    5,035
    I thought about it, and did that once before in my lifetime... but value the friendship more than the rights to images I really couldn't ever use in the future. In my case it was their party, their daughter, and their memories. The value of "rights" to any of that is zero to me. The value of their friendship... and they express thanks for that and comment on how happy they were with the photos every time I see them... is invaluable. Oddly, I have never seen the photos myself.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin