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  1. #1

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    Re: Question for those selling there photography...

    About what percentage ask you what kind of paper the photograph is printed on, and about what percentage demand fibre base paper. I am trying to get a feel for the demad before I make a lot of prints. I have been in touch with Kodak and Ilford companys both are claiming to have made great advancements in the archival qualities of RC paper. They both claim that with proper fixing and washing, and selenium toning that RC paper of today stands extremely close to fibre base paper, but they are both afraid to speak up about it, for fear of getting a bad reputation. There seems to be a wide spread unfounded fear of RC paper based on it's past from the 70's but hey, what has been made that did not get improvements, and we readily accept these products. Are we like the cat who sat on a hot stove, and because he got burned said to himself,"I will never sit on another stove again". Any way food for thought...
    A negative, can always be turned into a positive.

  2. #2
    ann
    ann is online now

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    anything i sell is sold with the understanding it has been made with the highest archival techniques available, which includes only using fiber papers, toned and mounted on 100% rag board.


    They have improved over the years, but i still don't like the look of the RC paper and will probably never use it. On the other hand, i am very old school and use graded fiber paper and intend to continue until it is no longer available.

    This is my personal opinion, and i would encourage you to decide what you want to do based on the work type, the look , etc. that you want for your photos. Also, which market are you selling to, may influence that decisions.

    .

  3. #3

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    Thanks Ann. I want to sell to the general public. I am not that interested in the collectors. I am really having trouble deciding on what paper to print on, my gut tells me that a very large majority will not even care, not that I am tring to decieve anyone, if they ask I will tell them. But I have to say that I am leaning toward RC Glossy, because it has a high reflectance and thus yeilds a viberant photograph. I specialize in landscapes. I welcome any comments or suggestions.
    A negative, can always be turned into a positive.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by ilfordrapid
    my gut tells me that a very large majority will not even care, not that I am trying to deceive anyone if they ask I will tell them. But I have to say that I am leaning toward RC
    Hi,
    I've sometimes wondered about this. On odd occasions when I've mentioned the type of paper I use to people, their eyes usually glaze over (in the style of glossy RC paper!). I suspect that it's what's on the paper that sells or doesn't sell it and that the longevity of a photographic image probably depends mostly on correct use of the chemicals, washing, and, most importantly, how and where the finished product is displayed. If someone walks off with one of my prints, I always warn against the dangers of strong sunlight, damp and heat. It's an interesting topic.

    Best wishes,
    Steve

  5. #5
    David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    You can get a glossy finish with glossy fiber based paper by ferrotyping. It's not as easy as RC, but the finish is glossier.

    I have my doubts about the longevity of RC papers on display. I have seen some prints from as late as the early 1990s that have silvered out after a few years framed in normal room light. If the prints don't need to stick around for more than a few years (proofs, headshots, promotional shots, prints for reproduction, etc.), RC is fine, but you don't see much in the way of B&W RC prints in galleries.

    If your goal is mainly to produce a clean looking product at low cost, and you like the look of an RC print, then stick with it. I'm also like Ann, though, in my preference for the look of graded fiber papers.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
    Photography (not as up to date as the flickr site)--http://www.davidagoldfarb.com/photo
    Academic (Slavic and Comparative Literature)--http://www.davidagoldfarb.com

  6. #6

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    David, thanks for your reply. I have to wonder though if the prints that you saw in the 1990's were actually processed properly, and selenium toned.
    A negative, can always be turned into a positive.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Roberts
    Hi,
    I've sometimes wondered about this. On odd occasions when I've mentioned the type of paper I use to people, their eyes usually glaze over (in the style of glossy RC paper!). I suspect that it's what's on the paper that sells or doesn't sell it and that the longevity of a photographic image probably depends mostly on correct use of the chemicals, washing, and, most importantly, how and where the finished product is displayed. If someone walks off with one of my prints, I always warn against the dangers of strong sunlight, damp and heat. It's an interesting topic.

    Best wishes,
    Steve
    Thanks Steve, I agree with you. I think it's what's on the paper that sells. Very few people who are not photographers, know our craft that well, and frankly don't give a rat's a** about the technical side. I have photos of me as a five year old that were taken with 120 film in an old Brownie camera, and the prints were made on glossy RC paper. Those prints are in mint condition. Because they were properly processed. Those prints are about 45 years old.
    A negative, can always be turned into a positive.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by ilfordrapid
    Thanks Steve, I agree with you. I think it's what's on the paper that sells. Very few people who are not photographers, know our craft that well, and frankly don't give a rat's a** about the technical side. I have photos of me as a five year old that were taken with 120 film in an old Brownie camera, and the prints were made on glossy RC paper. Those prints are in mint condition. Because they were properly processed. Those prints are about 45 years old.
    Hmm...I thought that RC paper was a more recent development...that would have it introduced in 1960 is what I hear you saying?

    There is another consideration beyond your limited view as it applies only to yourself. Consider this that the Library of Congress and the National Archives will not accept RC prints because they are not considered archival.

    So let's say that you set up shop selling cheap RC prints to unsuspecting and uninformed buyers and they think that they have made a great deal until the prints go south. Then the reputation of black and white images as being archival art is going to take a hit.

    That means that your customers start saying to their friends "black and white sucks and it isn't worth taking home." Pretty soon the word gets around and it makes no difference if David, Mike, Lee and everyone else who cares about what we do and make our prints on fiber based paper and are processed to archival standards is going to get the benefit of your trying to shortside and cut corners.

    Beyond that those of us who care about what we put out the door are going to have to justify why are work is worth more then your RC...all in all a wonderful gift that you are handing to us.

    Let me give you a premature and preemptive big "THANK YOU"

  9. #9
    Paul Sorensen's Avatar
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    I don't sell much, but I am involved in the occasional gallery show and have sold some work. I personally don't know that the buyer cares that much but I care a great deal, so I use fiber paper. I am actually using it more for the reason that it creates the look I am after, but I appreciate the fact that I can say that the prints I make are about as archival as gelatin silver prints can be. There is a level of professionalism that is communicated when you can say that. While I would not be surprised to hear that good RC prints will last a very long time, I don't imagine that they are as good as fiber.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald Miller
    Hmm...I thought that RC paper was a more recent development...that would have it introduced in 1960 is what I hear you saying?

    There is another consideration beyond your limited view as it applies only to yourself. Consider this that the Library of Congress and the National Archives will not accept RC prints because they are not considered archival.

    So let's say that you set up shop selling cheap RC prints to unsuspecting and uninformed buyers and they think that they have made a great deal until the prints go south. Then the reputation of black and white images as being archival art is going to take a hit.

    That means that your customers start saying to their friends "black and white sucks and it isn't worth taking home." Pretty soon the word gets around and it makes no difference if David, Mike, Lee and everyone else who cares about what we do and make our prints on fiber based paper and are processed to archival standards is going to get the benefit of your trying to shortside and cut corners.

    Let me give you a premature and preemptive big "THANK YOU"

    I am sorry you feel that way. Do you think I am the only one selling prints on RC paper. I care about what I do too. I am offering the customer a reasonalble product at a reasonable price, and there is no deceiving going on here. So climb on down off your high horse.
    A negative, can always be turned into a positive.

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