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  1. #21
    TheFlyingCamera's Avatar
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    You could also try split-grade printing. This takes some fussing around with to get it right, but it will help immensely in getting exactly what you want on the paper, as long as you have the detail you need in your negative. The how and the why has been discussed extensively here already, and far more comprehensively and accurately than I could recap in one post, so do a search on APUG for split grade printing.

  2. #22
    jp80874's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFlyingCamera
    You could also try split-grade printing. This takes some fussing around with to get it right, but it will help immensely in getting exactly what you want on the paper, as long as you have the detail you need in your negative. The how and the why has been discussed extensively here already, and far more comprehensively and accurately than I could recap in one post, so do a search on APUG for split grade printing.
    Thanks.
    Doing that with Les as my coach,
    or nag depending how you look at it.

    John Powers

  3. #23
    KenS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jp80874
    I am looking for the best separation of similar tones photographed in pretty dark settings.
    John,

    I am tempted to suggest (although it is difficult to judge without seeing the tonal range of the rock-face in question) but there might be one method that could "selectively" lighten some areas of the rock....

    Tone the print (but not to completion) with a selenium toner, then... after washing, treat the print with a solution of ferricyanide to remove some of the density from the "higher tone" surfaces where "all" the silver has not been changed to Ag selenide.

    Ken
    Quando omni flunkus moritati (R. Green)

  4. #24
    Bruce Osgood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KenS
    John,
    ... after washing, treat the print with a solution of ferricyanide to remove some of the density from the "higher tone" surfaces where "all" the silver has not been changed to Ag selenide.

    Ken
    How would you dilute ferricyanide to a wroking solution, say 1/2 gallon for an 11x14 tray? Or are you suggesting going at selected areas with a swab or something?

  5. #25

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    I would mention that split grade printing has limitations that are determined by the density range of the camera negative and the exposure scale of the paper on which the image is printed.

    For those times where these limitations prove too limiting, contrast enhancement masking is a viable alternative without the limitations of split grade printing.
    Art is a step from what is obvious and well-known toward what is arcane and concealed.

    Visit my website at http://www.donaldmillerphotography.com

  6. #26
    KenS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce (Camclicker)
    How would you dilute ferricyanide to a wroking solution, say 1/2 gallon for an 11x14 tray? Or are you suggesting going at selected areas with a swab or something?
    Bruce,

    I is a trick I was shown about 20 years ago but have ever only had to apply the technique once... on an scanning electron micrograph that could not be re-done after the stub was dropped and damaged... but a print from a less than good was needed for submission to a journal. I had just about forgotten all about the method until I had a chance to browse through a friend's copy of Barry Thornton's "Edge of Darkness" and saw what he had done to "greatly" improve a photograph that needed some "assistance".... Of course, I then went and bought a copy for myself.

    I would leave the swabs in the packet... leave them for when you need only "local bleaching on an untoned print, so go for full tray immersion since the Ag selenide in the lower tones will not respond to bleaching. I think an half gallon in an 11x14 tray might be a wee bit generous and be subject to slopping over with aggressive agitation. I would be tempted to go for (about) a 33% strength farmer's such that it does not "go" too fast... you want to pull it out a wee bit before the acceptable tone is reached.

    Ken
    Quando omni flunkus moritati (R. Green)

  7. #27
    jp80874's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KenS
    John,

    Tone the print (but not to completion) with a selenium toner, then... after washing, treat the print with a solution of ferricyanide to remove some of the density from the "higher tone" surfaces where "all" the silver has not been changed to Ag selenide.

    Ken
    Ken,

    Thank you. I would like to try that but I am allergic to ammonia, takes me right to the floor.

    Thanks,

    John P

  8. #28
    jp80874's Avatar
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    I started photographing the Rocks & Roots project many of you have helped me better understand. Loaded up the baby jogger with the 8x10 stuff and hiked up into the cliffs. Last evening as the first negatives came out of the Jobo I learned that it is harder than I knew to focus when it is so dark you need a six minute T Max 400 exposure @ f45. I also learned that my 8x10 camera has a lot more rise than my 300mm APO Symmar even though it has a 425mm image circle. It really was quite dark on Dave's very bright ground glass. Anyone with suggestions on how to see focus and vigneting in that little light will be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks,
    John Powers

  9. #29
    Les McLean's Avatar
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    John, take a piece of white card and lay it on the area where you have selected to focus. If it is still too dark I'm back to "the flashlight as part of the kit required to photograph in dark places", light the white card with the flashlight. Now how you do that while under the dark cloth is another question
    "Digital circuits are made from analogue parts"
    Fourtune Cookie-Brooklyn May 2006

    Website: www.lesmcleanphotography.com

  10. #30
    noseoil's Avatar
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    Try the old "mini light" focusing trick. Use two mini-mag lights set in the image at different places. Focus on the lights until they are correct, then remove the lights, stop down and shoot. If you are shooting in light this dark, a film which can be expanded fully will be a good choice. Still think Efke 25 is a decent choice, but I would use 4x5 to start out on this one, as trial and error will be what is needed. Sounds like a few acres of film may be expended to get the image you want. Best of luck, tim

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