First 'Group Photo' using B & W Film - Some questions

[ted_smith]

Hi

I am currently on a 5 week training course at work and I have told everyone that on the last day I'll take a group photo of us all as a keeps sake. My questions though, are these :

1) When using 35mm Kodak T-MAX 100 film to shoot a group of 17 people in mixed dress, probably indoors, would I be best using spot metering, centre weighted, or matrix? My film body is Nikon F80. I am thinking matrix. Would you agree?

2) When shooting digital, I usually expose for the highlights to avoid clipping. When using black and white film I am a little unsure. Am I best exposing for the shadows, or the highlights? I think I read somewhere it's the shadows?

3) I am thinking of using either my 20mm Superwide or my 50mm prime (if I can fit them in using that). If I use the 20mm, is there anything I should be aware of in advance when shooting a group photo? (I have only ever used it for landscapes). I am thinking that people on the periphery may get distorted?

4) If it proves necessary, I may need to use my Nikon SB800 flash. IS there anything I need to know for this scenario when using flash? I intend to simply hotshoe it using TTL metering possible using the diffuser to reduce shadows.

4) I intend to send the film to Peak Imaging (www.peak-imaging.co.uk) here in the UK as I heard they are really good. When having black and white film processed, is the choice of lab important or can any old lab deal with it in much the same way?

Thanks a lot for your advice in advance

Ted

[arigram]

Originally Posted by ted_smith

Hi

Hi!

1) When using 35mm Kodak T-MAX 100 film to shoot a group of 17 people in mixed dress, probably indoors, would I be best using spot metering, centre weighted, or matrix? I am thinking matrix. Would you agree?

If you know how to use it, spot is the best, but in your case maybe matrix if there is no background to confuse the meter. Go for centre if there is no deviation in lighting from the sides.

2) When shooting digital, I usually expose for the highlights to avoid clipping. When using black and white film I am a little unsure. Am I best exposing for the shadows, or the highlights? I think I read somewhere it's the shadows?

Expose for the shadows, but with a centre metering, that wouldn't be that accurate, even less with Matrix. Don't worry too much if you are in the ballpark. BW film has so much latitude that its difficult to lose detail if you do a descent metering.

3) I am thinking of using either my 20mm Superwide or my 50mm prime (if I can fit them in using that). If I use the 20mm, is there anything I should be aware of in advance when shooting a group photo? (I have only ever used it for landscapes). I am thinking that people on the periphery may get distorted?

You are correct on the last assumption but it all depends on the lens and how it handles distortion. The best approach is to take the shot standing as far back as possible. The 50 prime will give you the best quality with no distortion and with a normal perspective.

4) If it proves necessary, I may need to use my Nikon SB800 flash. IS there anything I need to know for this scenario when using flash? I intend to simply hotshoe it using TTL metering possible using the diffuser to reduce shadows.

If you use it as simple fill-in it would be ok, but don't rely on it for complete illumination as the result might not please you. Set it in wide angle mode if possible.

4) I intend to send the film to Peak Imaging (www.peak-imaging.co.uk) here in the UK as I heard they are really good. When having black and white film processed, is the choice of lab important or can any old lab deal with it in much the same way?

The development of BW film can vary depending on the chemicals used and on the procedure, but good labs might give you similar results.

[Ian Grant]

You will be making life difficult using 100 ISO film indoors without a flash, I used to use 200 ISO colour film in my Leica and that often meant shooting at a 30th @ f2 indoors. Will your flash give wide enough coverage to use the 20mm lens, most don't so a 28mm lens would be a better option.

There are very few good labs for B&W film now outside of London, so stick to who you know & trust for the processing.

Ian

[arigram]

Oh, yes, use a tripod. Definitely.

[pentaxuser]

I wasn't sure if Peak are going to do both film processing and printing but a lot of mini labs who are otherwise very good for colour can't /won't develop B&W film. There is a way round this which is to use a chromogenic B&W such as XP2+ which mini labs can handle. If you are then printing your own, fine. Otherwise the problem then arises with such mini labs in that if they can't handle B&W film, it's because they also use colour paper and chems. Sometimes B&W prints on colour paper look OK but they will look different from prints on B&W paper.

Will your fellow participants know or care about the difference? Only you can judge.

If top class genuine B&W prints are important then I'd go for a lab which has a reputation for handling both B&W film and prints well.

pentaxuser

[GeoffHill]

Originally Posted by ted_smith

Hi

I am currently on a 5 week training course at work and I have told everyone that on the last day I'll take a group photo of us all as a keeps sake. My questions though, are these :

1) When using 35mm Kodak T-MAX 100 film to shoot a group of 17 people in mixed dress, probably indoors, would I be best using spot metering, centre weighted, or matrix? My film body is Nikon F80. I am thinking matrix. Would you agree?

There probably isn't much between them unless you are shooting against a very bright or dark background. If its either, take a reading off the back of your hand and double it.

Originally Posted by ted_smith

3) I am thinking of using either my 20mm Superwide or my 50mm prime (if I can fit them in using that). If I use the 20mm, is there anything I should be aware of in advance when shooting a group photo? (I have only ever used it for landscapes). I am thinking that people on the periphery may get distorted?

If you cant get them in, I'd try and move somewhere else

Originally Posted by ted_smith

4) If it proves necessary, I may need to use my Nikon SB800 flash. IS there anything I need to know for this scenario when using flash? I intend to simply hotshoe it using TTL metering possible using the diffuser to reduce shadows.

I'd stick with a Tripod, and maybe even go for a slightly faster film rather than trying to light a large group with flash

Originally Posted by ted_smith

5) I intend to send the film to Peak Imaging (www.peak-imaging.co.uk) here in the UK as I heard they are really good. When having black and white film processed, is the choice of lab important or can any old lab deal with it in much the same way?

I'd go to Ilford for black and white prints, they'll come back on proper black and white paper

[fschifano]

Don't use TMX, it's too slow for the job. Use a 400 speed film instead. I like Tri-X or TMY. HP5+ and Delta 400 are just as good. Trust me on this one.

Matrix metering on Nikon cameras is usually pretty good. Trust it, and bracket around the recommended exposure if that makes you more comfortable.

Direct flash won't help you much if you use the 20mm lens, and it's generally uglier than sin anyway. You'll get severe light falloff at the edges of the picture. And yes, the people near the edges of the frame will look stretched out. You'll need to bounce the light off the ceiling and even that might not be enough. Once you start spreading the light out so thinly, there's not much left for the photograph.

[Christopher Walrath]

Originally Posted by ted_smith

1) When using 35mm Kodak T-MAX 100 film to shoot a group of 17 people in mixed dress, probably indoors, would I be best using spot metering, centre weighted, or matrix? My film body is Nikon F80. I am thinking matrix. Would you agree?

I would try to pay careful attention to the skin and make sure to get that spot on. Place white caucasian skin on zone VI and darker skin around zone IV.

2) When shooting digital, I usually expose for the highlights to avoid clipping. When using black and white film I am a little unsure. Am I best exposing for the shadows, or the highlights? I think I read somewhere it's the shadows?

With film, the general rule is to expose for the shadows, process for the highlights. But meter your most important components of the image and place them where you want them. You should have useful detail from exposure zones II through VIII.

3) I am thinking of using either my 20mm Superwide or my 50mm prime (if I can fit them in using that). If I use the 20mm, is there anything I should be aware of in advance when shooting a group photo? (I have only ever used it for landscapes). I am thinking that people on the periphery may get distorted?

Try to keep it normal. Wide can throw off the light at the edges especially with flash if you are not familiar with what you're doing. KISS.

4) If it proves necessary, I may need to use my Nikon SB800 flash. IS there anything I need to know for this scenario when using flash? I intend to simply hotshoe it using TTL metering possible using the diffuser to reduce shadows.

If you shoot wide, make to sure to zoom to your focal length or, if applicable, don't forget to attach your wide angle cover to spread the light over the whole image area.

5) I intend to send the film to Peak Imaging (www.peak-imaging.co.uk) here in the UK as I heard they are really good. When having black and white film processed, is the choice of lab important or can any old lab deal with it in much the same way?

B&W is a pretty simple process and now would be the perfect time for you to get your feet wet. As to lab, any pro lab should be sufficient for your needs. But it would be much more fun doing it yourself. Doesn't take much to get started either. You might even know someone who could show you the how-to's and use their gear just to get you hooked. Have fun.

[Christopher Walrath]

Oh, and make sure to tell everybody to make sure they can clearly see the camera or else it won't see them and they will not be visible in the image. And scream "I WANNA SEE TEETH!!!!!!!!!" Most should at least smile derisively.