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  1. #21
    rphenning's Avatar
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    shoulda just said , "yes sir, sorry sir", done some feigned button pressing on the back of your camera and bailed with your photos instead of trying to explain to the goof about film and digital and what not.

  2. #22

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    During the criminal tresspass era of my work, I always carried expired unexposed film cassettes with me and used these 'dummies' to satisfy the man. With great drama I would pull out the film, hold it up to the light, act contrite, etc. Meanwhile the exposed film was safe (yes, some slight of hand was required at times...)

    And now the karmic payback: a few weeks ago I was arrested for taking a picture of a water tank from a public sidewalk. The police were friendly. The water company cop was insistant that I get collared, even though the cops were on my side. They told me that the judge will throw it out as there is no evidence of trespassing. I loved the irony- years of sneaking around and finally popped on a legal location.

    NWG

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandholm View Post
    I think that magic word here is trespassing. In the "States" he could have been legally shoot by the security guard
    No, he could not.

    I get really sick of seeing the comments by people in other parts of the world, especially Europe, regarding how things are here in the US. News media cannot be trusted to give an accurate and complete picture.
    Movies and television are not reality. Shootouts as commonly portrayed are extremely rare. Most police officers in this country never discharge their weapon against another person in their entire careers.

    Here, no sworn law officer, much less some "rent-a-cop", as we commonly call them, could legally force anyone to delete or destroy photographs.

    There are stereotypes, many of which we have imposed on ourselves, of what things are like here. Even many Americans believe them.
    But we still have laws, we still have the Constitution. We are still very free here. The UK can ban political speech that could not be banned here. There will not be a law here against wearing a burqa, as is the case in France.

    Our society is not even close to being as violent as is often portrayed. Our society has many problems, but in a nation of so many different cultures, we get along pretty well.

    And no security guard is going to shoot me for trespassing.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by lxdude View Post
    The UK can ban political speech that could not be banned here.
    No it can't.... and it does not.


    Steve.
    "People who say things won't work are a dime a dozen. People who figure out how to make things work are worth a fortune" - Dave Rat.

  5. #25

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    not sure but i think an oil refinery might be considered a secure installation
    these days. and you were trespassing at an oil refinery, right chris ?

    a large gas/oil port near me is considered a tight security zone
    Last edited by jnanian; 02-10-2010 at 11:06 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by nawagi View Post
    During the criminal tresspass era of my work, I always carried expired unexposed film cassettes with me and used these 'dummies' to satisfy the man. With great drama I would pull out the film, hold it up to the light, act contrite, etc. Meanwhile the exposed film was safe (yes, some slight of hand was required at times...)

    And now the karmic payback: a few weeks ago I was arrested for taking a picture of a water tank from a public sidewalk. The police were friendly. The water company cop was insistant that I get collared, even though the cops were on my side. They told me that the judge will throw it out as there is no evidence of trespassing. I loved the irony- years of sneaking around and finally popped on a legal location.

    NWG
    They knowingly arrested you for doing something that was not illegal?

    That's false arrest, and the cops can, hell, should, get their asses busted for that. Doing it to placate the water company cop is no excuse. Being friendly is no excuse. Assuring you it will be thrown out is no excuse.

    Arresting someone without cause, i.e., knowing no crime had been committed, is unlawful, and a violation of your rights under the Constitution. The cops committed a crime. Sue them and your lawyer will tear them up. Sic the ACLU on them, and see how fast they apologize.
    I'd love to have something like this happen to me. I could retire early.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Smith View Post
    No it can't.... and it does not.


    Steve.
    Paul McCartney's song Give Ireland Back to the Irish was banned in the UK. A clear example of suppression of political speech, as I view political speech.

  8. #28
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    When you go out taking photos carry an old memory card with you. If you don't have one, go buy a cheap one.
    Beforehand, practice up on your sleight of hand.

    If anybody hassles you, flip a convenient lever on the camera, palm-off the digital memory card and show it to the idiot who is hassling you. After that, pretend to "power off" the camera, put the lens cap back on and snap the cover back onto the camera or otherwise obscure the camera from view. By putting the camera back into its case you are giving the appearance that you are not taking any more pictures.

    90% of the people today would not be able to tell the difference between a digital camera and a real camera from ten feet away. As long as you do what you are told, the guy will probably just tell you to leave and never come back. Ostensibly, you have complied with orders given. If you handed the guy a blank memory card and he tried to download it, he would never know that you did anything other than erase the data and hand it to him.

    But for military installations and other government facilities the only thing a security guard can do is eject you from the property or have you arrested for trespassing. If you are on public property there is nothing they can legally do except POLITELY ask you to leave. Also, if you are on public property, anybody can photograph anything they want as long as it is something that could be seen by an ordinary, law abiding citizen who was standing on the same spot. The right to publish those pictures is another kettle of fish.

  9. #29
    cmo
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    Quote Originally Posted by lxdude View Post
    I get really sick of seeing the comments by people in other parts of the world, especially Europe, regarding how things are here in the US. News media cannot be trusted to give an accurate and complete picture.
    In Europe most photographers are more concerned about how things are in the UK. There is a legendary thread in the Leica forum about stupid security dogmatists in London:

    http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-...criminals.html

    My favourite story: some austrian tourists were forced by policemen to delete photos of a bus station... it was this station:

    Google Street View

    Will british police stop drivers of Google camera cars?
    The future belongs to the few of us still willing to get our hands smell like fixing bath.

  10. #30

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    It's really no surprise that these guys over-react. They sit and stare at monitors or endlessly patrol the same route over & over & over. Nothing changes...not the scenery...not the course of the day. It's a very boring version of Groundhog Day. Then, prayers are answered and someone, maybe a terrorist or an evil doer, appears on the scene and starts indulging in suspicious activities. All the lectures and memos about being the frontline of defense and of being heroes floods his brain and he leaps into action. Flashlight at the ready he confronts this nefarious bastard and demands his film canister!

    A decisive win for freedom and democracy!!!

    Sorry, but I've had too many encounters with pin heads who have attempted to stop me from enjoying a legal, peaceful activity. I respect those security people that are truly involved in protecting critical assests. I don't respect those amoung them who switch off their brains.

    Best regards,

    Bob

    PS...fwiw telling armed Coast Guardmens repeatedly to f*%k themselves is not a good plan. Based on personal experience my advice is to say little and let them talk.
    Best regards,

    Bob
    CEO-CFO-EIEIO, Ret.

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