Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 71,958   Posts: 1,586,112   Online: 1149
      
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 36
  1. #11
    kerne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Tallahassee, FL
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    149
    eBay may not have been able to do much for Jon's situation, but their policies and fees for sellers have progressively worsened over the years. I personally would rather sell an item here, through Craigslist or put a classified ad in the local paper than use them.

  2. #12
    blansky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Wine country in Northern California
    Posts
    5,054
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfeye View Post
    I think, as a society, we've lost so much civility in the digital age that this sort of behavior has become commonplace. I recall a wedding photographer whose carefully set up and arranged group shot was captured "over the shoulder" by an Uncle Bob wannabe, and the results ended up published in a bridal magazine.

    I mean, there have always been low-lifes who'll steal and copy another's work, but it just seems now, with the internet and digital, there's more of them.
    You don't think people did this in the film age? Copying has been around as long as people had the means to do it.

    I had clients that brought relatives to shoot my wedding setups, family setups and even had a moron think he could shoot behind me in my studio. All circa 1980
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  3. #13
    sandermarijn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Leiden, Netherlands
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    770
    Images
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post
    Ebay doesn't suck. Ebay had NOTHING to do with it.
    I do not agree. Jon's copycat went as far as copying and selling his instructions with the exact same kit. That must certainly be a breach of some kind of right (copyright probably, but again, I'm not familiar enough with matters of law to get this kind of reference exactly correct). Ebay refused to help Jon rid the copycats. To me that sucks.

    On top of the above comes the issue of business ethics. Business is not without ethics. Ebay surely perfectly understands that refusing help to a long standing good member (17,479 feedbacks, 100% score) is not right. Being a large company is no excuse for not caring about individual customers. The same ethics that apply to any human being doing business with another human being apply to ebay as well.

    In my personal opinion (everybody has the right to have a different opinion) ebay was professionally and ethically lacking in Jon's case.

  4. #14
    markbarendt's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Beaverton, OR, USA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    5,796
    Blog Entries
    3
    Images
    19
    Quote Originally Posted by blansky View Post
    You don't think people did this in the film age? Copying has been around as long as people had the means to do it.

    I had clients that brought relatives to shoot my wedding setups, family setups and even had a moron think he could shoot behind me in my studio. All circa 1980
    Oh yeah, been there, had gramma (and others) telling me to move so they could get a shot.

    It has become A huge problem for the older business modles.
    Mark Barendt, Beaverton, OR

    "We do not see things the way they are. We see things the way we are." Anaïs Nin

  5. #15

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Lower Michigan, USA
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    378
    I am someone who has occasionally bought from Ebay and very infrequently sold via Ebay.

    My understanding is that over the past two to three years they have changed most of their policies to greatly favor the buyer. While they do need tools to remove unscrupulous sellers, they have gone much too far in the opposite direction. It has now become a "Seller beware" organization. Any disputes are almost always, and pretty much automatically decided in favor of the buyer, and the unscrupulous have figured this out and are taking advantage.

    Since it is the sellers who are paying the exorbitant and multiple fees to Ebay, they should be able to expect some support, but it is not there very often.

  6. #16
    CGW
    CGW is offline

    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    2,797
    Does Hermes sell the leather and hardware for Birkin bags alongside the finished product? If it did, would it have any grounds for complaint against resellers of finished bags made from Hermes materials?

  7. #17

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Maryland, USA
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    630
    Quote Originally Posted by sandermarijn View Post
    I do not agree. Jon's copycat went as far as copying and selling his instructions with the exact same kit. That must certainly be a breach of some kind of right (copyright probably, but again, I'm not familiar enough with matters of law to get this kind of reference exactly correct). Ebay refused to help Jon rid the copycats. To me that sucks.
    I don't see where Jon stated that the other guy was selling the kits on eBay. And even if he is, he'd have to display the stolen instructions on his auction page in order to have eBay act on any complaint by Jon. eBay can't remove listings just because it "feels" wrong. They need proof, and they can and do act on copyright violations. BTW, buying the general kits and doing a pre-cut sale is, I believe, perfectly legal, as long as the seller doesn't make any attempt to infer any connection to Jon. Obviously, doctoring the instructions is not legal.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandermarijn View Post
    On top of the above comes the issue of business ethics. Business is not without ethics. Ebay surely perfectly understands that refusing help to a long standing good member (17,479 feedbacks, 100% score) is not right. Being a large company is no excuse for not caring about individual customers. The same ethics that apply to any human being doing business with another human being apply to ebay as well.
    So if I, as a long standing good member of eBay, asked them to take out a competitor, they should do it because of "ethics", even if I can't prove the other guy is doing anything wrong? Wow. Glad I don't live in that world.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandermarijn View Post
    In my personal opinion (everybody has the right to have a different opinion) ebay was professionally and ethically lacking in Jon's case.
    So the arguments so far are:

    1) eBay should remove the copycat even if they can't see that he's a copycat.

    2) eBay should remove the copycat because Jon is a good guy and a long standing good customer.

    3) eBay should remove the copycat because their fees and policies toward sellers have gotten worse (a total non-sequitur argument).

    4) eBay should remove the copycat because not doing so feels wrong ethically.

    Fail.

  8. #18
    Jon Goodman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    656
    Hi Folks,
    Thanks for all the nice and complimentary words first off! I feel like Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn watching their own funeral. You folks are all terrific friends, and I value friendships greatly. As for the kits, I am still selling them...although only directly at this point. You've already been furnished my email address, and while I receive on the average 100+ email messages each day on light seal or camera repair questions, I'll always answer. If you don't hear from me in a day or two, please re-send the message or contact me via the message function of APUG. Some messages do go to my spam folder for reasons unknown.

    As for plans about the website, demands on my time have meant I am a bit hesitant. More to follow when things become a bit less hectic.

    As for changes in the way the kits are sold, rest assured all decisions were considered carefully based on facts, fundamental changes, risks and realities. Everyone involved in the evaluation process all walked with feet of lead.

    There are plenty of positives. I expect the light seal project to continue for decades to come. As always even if I don't have a kit, I'm happy to help anyone get their camera back on "the dark side." Additionally I do still sell leather & leatherette covers made in Germany for some camera models and I do still make & sell the "tri-dot" battery adapter (which converts a common hearing aid battery into a clone of the PX-13/PX-625 mercury cell).

    Most importantly, please feel free to contact me. I'm very happy to hear from all of you.

    Jon

  9. #19
    blansky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Wine country in Northern California
    Posts
    5,054
    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Goodman View Post
    Hi Folks,
    Thanks for all the nice and complimentary words first off! I feel like Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn watching their own funeral. You folks are all terrific friends, and I value friendships greatly. As for the kits, I am still selling them...although only directly at this point. You've already been furnished my email address, and while I receive on the average 100+ email messages each day on light seal or camera repair questions, I'll always answer. If you don't hear from me in a day or two, please re-send the message or contact me via the message function of APUG. Some messages do go to my spam folder for reasons unknown.

    As for plans about the website, demands on my time have meant I am a bit hesitant. More to follow when things become a bit less hectic.

    As for changes in the way the kits are sold, rest assured all decisions were considered carefully based on facts, fundamental changes, risks and realities. Everyone involved in the evaluation process all walked with feet of lead.

    There are plenty of positives. I expect the light seal project to continue for decades to come. As always even if I don't have a kit, I'm happy to help anyone get their camera back on "the dark side." Additionally I do still sell leather & leatherette covers made in Germany for some camera models and I do still make & sell the "tri-dot" battery adapter (which converts a common hearing aid battery into a clone of the PX-13/PX-625 mercury cell).

    Most importantly, please feel free to contact me. I'm very happy to hear from all of you.

    Jon
    Jon, don't know you, or your product BUT seriously not having time to make a website is like a photographer not having time to check his camera.

    There are many companies that can set you up with an inexpensive website, easy to use, easy to change whatever, that can have you up and running in a couple of days.

    Seriously, if you have a product, you have to have a website.

    Take the time.
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  10. #20
    Jon Goodman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    656
    Thanks Blansky,
    I realize I need to go forward with it. Actually 2 sites have been set up, and hopefully soon at least one of them will be operational. It isn't so much that I don't want to activate it, but I have a few personal things requiring a large bit of my time and I'd rather not do a sloppy job of it. Thanks again for the suggestion.
    Best regards,
    Jon

Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin