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  1. #41
    CPorter's Avatar
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    Without reading through all the responses, no need to really, put the camera down, help save a life.......

  2. #42
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    Pop Quiz: A train is about to hit someone and you have your camera. What do you do?

    After looking at the article I realize that particular track is double sided and all the victim had to do was walk to the other side, there was no reason he couldn't I've been at that stop many times.

    Whether in panic the man didn't realize that, he still could have saved himself easily.


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    The Noteworthy Ones - Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1 / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic

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    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  3. #43
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    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murde...itty_Genoveses


    This article is about the psychological phenomenon. For the bystander effect in radiobiology, see Bystander effect (radiobiology).
    The bystander effect or Genovese syndrome is a social psychological phenomenon that refers to cases where individuals do not offer any means of help in an emergency situation to the victim when other people are present. The probability of help has often appeared to be inversely related to the number of bystanders; in other words, the greater the number of bystanders, the less likely it is that any one of them will help. The mere presence of other bystanders greatly decreases intervention. In general, this is believed to happen because as the number of bystanders increases, any given bystander is less likely to notice the situation, interpret the incident as a problem, and less likely to assume responsibility for taking action.
    Everytime I find a film or paper that I like, they discontinue it. - Paul Strand - Aperture monograph on Strand

  4. #44
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    Pop Quiz: A train is about to hit someone and you have your camera. What do you do?

    This is what it looks like from the other side of the track in a similar station in NYC...

    Mind the crappy image it was an experimental roll of 70mm GAF aerial film that expired in 1967, it shoots fairly well for its age but it was low light long exposure in the subway type deal ya know...followed by the fact I didn't fix it for long enough apparently and since has darkened, I went to scan it (tonight) and discovered this, so spent this gap in time to re-fix all 15 feet in single image clippings... Fun.....




    ~Stone

    The Noteworthy Ones - Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1 / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic

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    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  5. #45
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    Is Abbasi getting an unfair amount of criticism?
    There were other people there.
    Who knows how far away he really was.
    Could he have done anything if he didn't take the photo.
    How much time did he have.
    There are other circumstances that could have contributed to his inaction. But it wasn't really inaction. He did do something. He took a picture. A previous poster called it a crappy image. I have to disagree with that opinion or at least say it isn't that bad. If it were crappy we would have an easier time believing his story that it was an incidental result of his trying to get the driver's attention. I think the composition is what gets me the most even though that could easily have been adjusted in post. It gives the impression that there was deliberate thought put into making the image. And I think that is where the criticism is coming from. I guess the idea is that, unlike the other people there, his brain didn't lock up. I also think he's taking a lot of heat as a result of the headline the paper used. "How can someone stand there and take a picture?" was something that crossed my mind when I first saw it. I didn't think of the possible circumstances surrounding the tragedy and I have to wonder why is it so easy to presume that he could have done something?

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benoît99 View Post
    The man would still be alive if the architects and engineers who built the N.Y. Subway had done it right. In the Stockholm, Sweden subway, there is a one-meter space next to the track that extends under the platform, providing refuge for anyone who falls off the platform onto the tracks.

    Frankly, it's surprising the New York subway has not already been successfully sued for such an obvious and deadly design flaw.
    There is a space under the platforms. When I used to ride the subway on a daily basis I considered crawling under the platform as the first option in case I ever found myself down there when a train was coming. I guess I'm just repeating StoneNYC in saying that Mr. Han had other options besides climbing back on the platform. I'm not trying to implicate Mr. Han in his own death, just correcting the quoted post. Everyone has a plan until there's a train heading at them.

  7. #47
    Newt_on_Swings's Avatar
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    Pop Quiz: A train is about to hit someone and you have your camera. What do you do?

    There is usually a space under the platform for someone to hide under, but this is not always the case and depends on the station. A notable one would be 14th st union sq where the platform is mechanized and slides out at certain points on the curved station track and therefore can't accommodate a space.

    Other stations have slots built into the walls to fit a grown man easily if you stand up and lean into them. I have seen workers use them in this capacity.

    There is however a channel cut into the entire length of the track of every station large enough for a man to lie down completely and not be hit if you go into a prone superman state and let the train pass over.

    The easiest would be just to walk over to the otherside if it was a double sided track station. There are stairs at each end of the platforms to walk up behind the swinging barriers.

    I've been down on NYC tracks before and it is a little bit of a jump and a push to get back up. For comparison the T in Boston is barely a step high in many stations.

  8. #48
    David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    There is also an electrified shoe on both sides of the train, even though the electrified rail is on the inside, so the cars can move between tracks and change direction without having to be rotated, so it isn't necessarily safe to be in the space between the track and the platform, in stations where there seems to be adequate clearance.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
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  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by Newt_on_Swings View Post

    I've been down on NYC tracks before and it is a little bit of a jump and a push to get back up. For comparison the T in Boston is barely a step high in many stations.
    you are right newt_on _swings ..
    i was on the redline platform .. and it was a good 5-6 foot drop
    other places on the red line ( charles ) not even a step since it is on a bridge
    but kendal, central harvard, porter, davis and aelwife are all a 5-6' drop ( sometimes more ! )

    i guess people feel inadequate or afraid for their life so they don't help. i am trained in lifesaving/first aid
    emergency preparedness and survival from an early age so i am kind of prepared to help if i can ...
    i feel sorry for anyone these days who gets hurt and a crowd just watches ... or ignores.

    i had a friend who witnessed a car wreck back maybe 25 years ago. he pulled over, pulled the guy out of the wreck
    and saved his life ..... and people said " wasn't he worried about getting aids or hep. or hurt " he kind of shook his head
    and said if he didn't do what he did, the guy would have been dead and he would have been one of the lame people who just pass by.

    oh well, people gotta do what they gotta do ..

  10. #50

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    As David points out, the space under the platform is not necessarily safe. The trough between the tracks often has debris and/or some water in it, and appears quite narrow. To get in between the two sets of tracks involves stepping over the electrified third rail. None of these possible escapes would be inviting to someone in imminent mortal danger. Attempting to get back onto the platform would have been obvious split-second choice.

    I heard Mr. Abbasi's explanation of inaction on the local news radio. He said he had defensively put his back up against a wall, as the pusher was running directly towards him. He seemed to indicate that he was operating the camera not to take pictures, but to cause the flash to repeatedly fire and alert the train's motorman of the situation.

    Although young at the time, I recall the Kitty Genovese incident, which evolved over a period of time during which numerous people ignored cries for help, rather than make an anonymous phone call. Given our current culture, I'd like to think it wouldn't happen again, but then, I'd like to think I'd have helped Mr Han, rather than stand frozen, thinking, 'Somebody should help than man'. Who knows?

    Charley

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