Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 69,752   Posts: 1,515,889   Online: 1012
      
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 40
  1. #21
    Sparky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    2,100
    presumably because things like 'detail' are easily replaced by 'jpeg aliasing' - the photograph has become largely uninteresting to the gentry except for the values/fashions it connotes... well I hope it's not THAT bad... but I wouldn't be so surprised if it does soon...

  2. #22

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Midlands, UK
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    917
    Quote Originally Posted by PKM-25 View Post
    I find the Internet as a whole to be one of the worst "windbags" of doom and gloom I have ever seen. When I significantly limit my time on it, get and shoot and talk to people in person, there is a much more balanced and nuanced perception going on in terms of nearly every topic, including photography and the art world.

    I just don't even care anymore what the buzz is, I do things my way, keep showing clients images they have never seen before and it just plain works. This is especially true of my fine art work that never sees the use of a computer. I am seeing uncharted territory in my future and as long as that is what is on the horizon, I know what my market is and how to keep it fresh...

    Obstacles are what you see when you take your eyes off the goal.....the Internet is most certainly one of those distractions...
    I have to say I agree.
    'Cows are very fond of being photographed, and, unlike architecture, don't move.' - Oscar Wilde

  3. #23
    MartinCrabtree's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Back in the hills
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    634
    Images
    2
    The number of images only bothers me because people have no manners whatsoever anymore. I shoot for me (even electronic stuff) so what you think is considered however it is secondary.

    Then again my paycheck currently comes from something else entirely. I will soon find out how well that philosophy serves me when it puts food on the table. Wish me luck.

  4. #24
    benjiboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    U.K.
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    6,635
    Quote Originally Posted by MartinCrabtree View Post
    I prefer to be harshly judged by my peers than rewarded by the naive.
    What an interesting thought Martin and very true, to win against third rate opposition isn't any great achievement.
    Ben

  5. #25

    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    53

    RE: The sea of images

    Most people happily snapping away are not really taking pictures. They are taking reminders that help them retrieve a memory. The art market, and the schlock market, is likely unchanged per capita. Some people want to buy the art that is the original Ansel Adams print. Others are happy with the paper calendar version. You were never going to sell to the second group anyway, not now, not 50 years ago.
    Sent from my PI86100 using Board Express
    My flickr stream

  6. #26
    Worker 11811's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,620
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparky View Post
    As the digital medium and the ubiquity of cheap equipment informs the pool of photographic imagery inhabiting the galleries - our set of requirements for 'quality' will slowly shift to accommodate this new work and new kinds of quality that we cannot yet imagine perhaps. What WE consider high quality will become nearly invisible to others (and even to ourselves) as this happens.
    I recently had an experience like this while installing a digital projector in a theater. The factory technician had just finished making final calibrations on the system and ran some test material. Everybody was standing around, watching the picture, marveling at how good it looked. I walked in, looked at the picture for about a minute and said that the color was off and the contrast needed to be adjusted. They all got real quiet and the technician looked at me like I just killed his puppy.

    The test reel ran again and I pointed out the problems. "This person's face is too dark. The background is all blown out. There is a blue color cast. Etc." The technician looked for about a half minute but couldn't see the problem. The rest of the people just turned around and walked out. It was clear that nobody WANTED to see the deficiencies in the image and they were willing to ignore them because they wanted to believe that "digital is better just because it's digital."

    A little while later, people started talking about how there is no dust or scratches in the digital image like there is with film. My answer was, "If the film projector is cleaned and properly maintained, there won't be dust or scratches." ...Silence... "But the film projector has a jittery image," one person said. My answer was, "If you replace the worn out film guides in the projector and adjust the gate tension like it's supposed to be, that won't happen." Again, dead puppies!

    I'm a techie guy. I love to tinker with computers and digital stuff. I know that film has its strengths and weaknesses just the same as digital does. I like to work with BOTH and I like to make both images look as good as I know how. In my view of a perfect world, film and digital will work side by side, each to its own strengths and with operators who work to use both kinds of equipment to make the best product they can.

    I agree with you. There are many people who just can't see the difference and there are many people who just refuse to admit that the can see a difference. Out of the group of people who can see a difference, many of them are quickly loosing the ability to tell the difference at all.
    Randy S.

    In girum imus nocte et consumimur igni.

    -----

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/randystankey/

  7. #27

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Midlands, UK
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    917
    Quote Originally Posted by Worker 11811 View Post
    Everybody was standing around, watching the picture, marveling at how good it looked. I walked in, looked at the picture for about a minute and said that the color was off and the contrast needed to be adjusted. They all got real quiet and the technician looked at me like I just killed his puppy.
    If you walked into my place of work with this 'method', I couldn't care less about your expertise. There are better ways to bring people round to your way of thinking.
    There's a sense of pride in your anecdote. You seem to really enjoy being a jerk.

    The test reel ran again and I pointed out the problems. "This person's face is too dark. The background is all blown out. There is a blue color cast. Etc." The technician looked for about a half minute but couldn't see the problem. The rest of the people just turned around and walked out. It was clear that nobody WANTED to see the deficiencies in the image and they were willing to ignore them because they wanted to believe that "digital is better just because it's digital."
    This is such a fundamental flaw in social perception, and just general thinking, I can almost imagine exactly what you're like to be around. No, they didn't believe it was better, they almost certainly walked out because of your overbearingly putrid smugness.
    Last edited by batwister; 03-01-2013 at 09:42 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    'Cows are very fond of being photographed, and, unlike architecture, don't move.' - Oscar Wilde

  8. #28

    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    15,788
    Quote Originally Posted by batwister View Post
    If you walked into my place of work with this 'method', I couldn't care less about your expertise. There are better ways to bring people round to your way of thinking.
    There's a sense of pride in your anecdote. You seem to really enjoy being a jerk.



    This is such a fundamental flaw in social perception, and just general thinking, I can almost imagine exactly what you're like to be around. No, they didn't believe it was better, they almost certainly walked out because of your overbearingly putrid smugness.
    batwister

    i don't think randy was being a jerk at all.
    if you know anything about him, you know he is a projectionist at a movie theatre
    who knows his craft. you know that over the last few years the studios have
    forced theatres to "upgrade" their projection systems to obscenely expensive digital systems
    which is forcing the smaller projection houses to not show, while at the same time
    making HUGE profits, and cramming poorly projected images down our throats that we pay 10$/ seat for.

    the sorry fact is that society is being dumbed-down. ..

    what matters is all that matters, and no one really knows what that is yet,
    and chances are they won't know until it is too late.

    RIGHT ON RANDY !

  9. #29

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    San Diego, CA, USA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    2,206
    Images
    21
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparky View Post
    presumably because things like 'detail' are easily replaced by 'jpeg aliasing' - the photograph has become largely uninteresting to the gentry except for the values/fashions it connotes... well I hope it's not THAT bad... but I wouldn't be so surprised if it does soon...
    I have to say, I think people have always thought that. Not about JPEG aliasing specifically, of course, but it's a truism that the history of photography is full of convenience triumping over image quality, and corresponding wailing and gnashing of teeth from the old guard about what IGNORANT PHILISTINES the dry-plate/film/medium-format/35mm/p&s/d*g*t*l/d*g*cam/phone people were and how it would all lead to THE END OF THE ENTIRE WORLD. (I hope the hyperbole is obvious---I don't think you're being nearly that distraught really.)

    And on the one hand, it's true; there's a significant loss of image quality between an 11x14 wet plate and an iPhone. On the other hand, for most viewers, and not just naive or uneducated ones, subject, light, and composition will trump technical image quality every time, and a photo that was shot is always better than one that wasn't. (I'm looking at a personal favorite of mine, a spontaneous candid of my 4-year old son, taken in a restaurant in Malaysia; 35mm Tri-X in Diafine. Lots of grain, lots of contrast, dynamic range limited by the push to EI 1250, resolution and tonality limited by the miniature format---but well lit, decently composed, and a badass portrait of the kind of living-in-the-moment concentration that only small children display regularly, if I do say so myself; and of course utterly impossible to take at all on that 11x14 wet plate!)

    On the other other hand, I have one of my great-grandfather's prints on the wall at home; it's an 11x14 contact print on Azo, and to the educated eye it looks like it---it has that almost-3-dimensional Azo thing, you can just plunge into the detail, and so on. And people notice that even though they don't know what they're noticing. More than one person has spontaneously said "Holy sh*t!" out loud the first time they saw it; non-photo-geeks, I'm speaking of, people who have some sense in their heads and can make their own aesthetic judgements, but people who wouldn't know a contact print from contact dermatitis if they had one in each hand. So the tools can make their virtues known through the strength of the image, which I think we all believe or we wouldn't be here.

    Bottom line---I just think that, as people who perpetrate images, we assume the responsibility to make our tools work for the image. And that goes for the painters and the mixed-media assemblage artists and the iPhone photographers as well as for the film folks. Sometimes that means something unique to the tool (think of cyanotypes---you couldn't really produce that look with any other technique), sometimes it's just a strong image made with what happens to be the artist's toolset of choice. I don't see that the increasing convenience and popularity of certain tools changes that responsibility in any way.

    </soapbox>

    -NT
    Nathan Tenny
    San Diego, CA, USA

    The lady of the house has to be a pretty swell sort of person to put up with the annoyance of a photographer.
    -The Little Technical Library, _Developing, Printing, And Enlarging_

  10. #30

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Midlands, UK
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    917
    You can't walk into a room with the attitude of "I know best, move aside", even if you do. This aggressiveness towards 'the ignorant' is a dangerous and growing problem - partly fueled by the internet; 'a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing' as they say. You see it with the new wave of Atheists too, using every opportunity in conversation to create tension with their views. These self-righteous and crusading ideas about declining quality need to stop, people need to take the middle ground a bit more. I say this after recently selling my last DSLR lens, which hasn't been used for a year.
    I was out of line to call him a jerk, so apologies, but I still think it's twisted to boast about ostracizing people.

    I understand the movie situation. I've actually just watched 'Side by Side', a film which deals with the issue. Beside the fact that it's not a very good film, there isn't a conclusion drawn, even from great filmmakers at the top of their game. Even Wally Pfister, incidently, has come round to the digital idea. But I guess he has little choice, in the end.
    Last edited by batwister; 03-01-2013 at 01:04 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    'Cows are very fond of being photographed, and, unlike architecture, don't move.' - Oscar Wilde

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin