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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by batwister View Post
    So the question that remains for me is, would he have passed by this burning car if the colours 'weren't right' and would you and I? It's interesting to me what we find photographic, why we find it photographic and the connotations of the subject which are either emphasised or rendered incidental through intent.
    No, No. No matter what your slant, you've photographed it due to its rarity should you be out photographing these kinds of environments. For eg, say a Armenian concert photographer saw the most perfect scene of a fan in a Union Jack shirt running up to hug the lead singer of a Surinamese band....I highly doubt the photographer would pass on this opportunity......same thing here. Now would the colors/symbols mesh to create the magic image? That is what the definition of art is......
    Andy

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by batwister View Post
    That's kind of true and I'll admit, the picture must have some cultural intrigue for me for that reason, but on a more basic level, it's the peculiarities of artistic intention. For the purposes of a discussion, it doesn't really matter if the picture takes your fancy, as I'm trying to be objective about its making myself. Like I say, today this would be an iPhone shot in the local newspaper with the headline 'moments before disaster'. Yet it's not about what's actually happening for me, and I dare say the photographer. It's more the mystery of circumstance, which I was trying to address. It's almost the perfect 'found object' for a photographer concerned with documenting the modern city, as it is, yet as an image, it is transcended through a striking response to colour - which creates a kind of push-pull (subjective-aesthetic) effect. So the question that remains for me is, would he have passed by this burning car if the colours 'weren't right' and would you and I? It's interesting to me what we find photographic, why we find it photographic and the connotations of the subject which are either emphasised or rendered incidental through intent.
    For me I would take this picture and probably look for some better or more interesting angles before the thing blew up.

    As for the color aspects you find interesting, I experience color more intuitively and the blue/ red dynamic only would mean something to me if it was a striking picture.

    This is to me a picture I would take but would probably never do anyone with, which I probably have thousands.
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  3. #23
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    The more I look at it, the more I believe it. I believe photographer happened upon a smoky car and thought it cool... setup the shot expecting just an ordinary scene where owner lifts hood of car and solves the problem. Then this happened and he had no choice but to shoot. The owner had already run for his life.

    I could be projecting, and I know nothing for sure. But if I happened upon a smoking car, I sure would get my camera out. If it caught while I was watching, I'd shoot film. Heck I've had this happen to one of my cars (almost). But I got there to the carburetor and extinguished the little flame before it ran down the fuel line. I wasn't taking pictures at the time.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by blansky View Post

    This is to me a picture I would take but would probably never do anyone with, which I probably have thousands.
    That was supposed to be ANYTHING with......damn autocorrect.
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  5. #25
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    I reread the thread and caught more of your drift on color and its power/relationship in a photograph.

    Here's my theory on color theory, composition bokeh, etc. My theory is, it makes a great sauce/spice.

    If you have me over for dinner and you make me a great steak with a wonderful sauce on it, then say what do you think? Don't you love the sauce?

    I'll say yes it was incredible. But the next week you invite me back and make a steak with the same sauce but the steak is hard and tough. Then you say how did you like the sauce. I'll say the steak was tough. And you say but the sauce was great. Wasn't it? And the answer is, it doesn't matter the steak was tough.

    So in a photograph you have a scene with great color arrangements and then say, isn't this a great picture? Well was the picture a great picture before the color arrangements? If yes. Great. If not. Who cares about the color.

    If you have a photograph of a women's breasts and who doesn't love breasts. And you say look at her breasts, beautifully lit, round, etc etc but they are attached to a 55 year old with the face of a witch. And I say ewwwww. You say what? They are beautiful breasts.

    Then you show me another picture of a women's breasts, same thing beautifully lit, etc and she has a gorgeous face with a nice expression. And you say, what do you think. I say, I love it. So you say well whats the difference, they both have beautiful breasts. And my answer is yes but the first one made me throw up in my mouth. I don't care about her breasts.

    Take Steve McCurry's Afghan Girl photograph from National Geographic, and you could argue about color theory and how the colors make the picture. And I would say no, the colors spice the picture. The picture would still be impactful in black and white. The haunting eyes are what make the picture.

    So to make a short story long, to me, coming across a photograph or scene that has great composition, or color, or a scene that has someone's theory of color, and thinking that it's a great or even good because of that, is a false idea.

    To me the picture has to have impact or other elements in it to engage me, and then artsy rules and ideas can then add spice to it, to make it great.

    So your car on fire example. For me there is nothing in the picture that the color of the cars adds or detracts that would make it anything more than a mundane car fire. Would I take the picture? Yes. Probably because it's on fire. But the colors of the car are pretty much irrelevant as is the picture.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails afghan.jpg   afghan1.jpg  
    Last edited by blansky; 05-20-2013 at 11:18 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by blansky View Post
    I reread the thread and caught more of your drift on color and its power/relationship in a photograph.

    Here's my theory on color theory, composition bokeh, etc. My theory is, it makes a great sauce/spice.

    If you have me over for dinner and you make me a great steak with a wonderful sauce on it, then say what do you think? Don't you love the sauce?

    I'll say yes it was incredible. But the next week you invite me back and make a steak with the same sauce but the steak is hard and tough. Then you say how did you like the sauce. I'll say the steak was tough. And you say but the sauce was great. Wasn't it? And the answer is, it doesn't matter the steak was tough.

    So in a photograph you have a scene with great color arrangements and then say, isn't this a great picture? Well was the picture a great picture before the color arrangements? If yes. Great. If not. Who cares about the color.

    If you have a photograph of a women's breasts and who doesn't love breasts. And you say look at her breasts, beautifully lit, round, etc etc but they are attached to a 55 year old with the face of a witch. And I say ewwwww. You say what? They are beautiful breasts.

    Then you show me another picture of a women's breasts, same thing beautifully lit, etc and she has a gorgeous face with a nice expression. And you say, what do you think. I say, I love it. So you say well whats the difference, they both have beautiful breasts. And my answer is yes but the first one made me throw up in my mouth. I don't care about her breasts.

    Take Steve McCurry's Afghan Girl photograph from National Geographic, and you could argue about color theory and how the colors make the picture. And I would say no, the colors spice the picture. The picture would still be impactful in black and white.

    So to make a short story long, to me, coming across a photograph or scene that has great composition, or color, or a scene that has someone's theory of color, and thinking that it's a great or even good because of that, is a false idea.

    To me the picture has to have impact or other elements in it to engage me, and then artsy rules and ideas can then add spice to it, to make it great.

    So your car on fire example. For me there is nothing in the picture that the color of the cars adds or detracts that would make it anything more than a mundane car fire. Would I take the picture? Yes. Probably because it's on fire. But the colors of the car are pretty much irrelevant as is the picture.
    Agree with some of this post, but certainly not about your 'old woman/young woman, nice breasts' analogy. Despite it being unquestionably sexist, I actually think a picture (!) of an old woman with a young woman's breasts would be... interesting. I'm imagining an unpublished Diane Arbus in fact. But you make a fair point about the ubiquitous Afghan Girl, while quietly redeeming yourself on the gender politics front

    As for the Brohm picture being 'irrelevant', well, clearly many galleries and publishers disagree.

    With some intellectually driven colour photography, subject matter is understood as a mere necessity, a burden even, and used simply as an anchor around which to explore the medium. Which is exactly what Eggleston did, then Shore and Brohm. Steve McCurry on the other hand is a classical humanitarian photographer and so his methodology is about 'embracing' the subject. And definitely, I love the word 'spice' to describe the aesthetics of his pictures, considering the exotic places he makes them. But it doesn't ring as true with Brohm in my mind.
    'Cows are very fond of being photographed, and, unlike architecture, don't move.' - Oscar Wilde

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by batwister View Post
    Agree with some of this post, but certainly not about your 'old woman/young woman, nice breasts' analogy. Despite it being unquestionably sexist, I actually think a picture (!) of an old woman with a young woman's breasts would be... interesting. I'm imagining an unpublished Diane Arbus in fact. But you make a fair point about the ubiquitous Afghan Girl, while quietly redeeming yourself on the gender politics front

    As for the Brohm picture being 'irrelevant', well, clearly many galleries and publishers disagree.

    With some intellectually driven colour photography, subject matter is understood as a mere necessity, a burden even, and used simply as an anchor around which to explore the medium. Which is exactly what Eggleston did, then Shore and Brohm. Steve McCurry on the other hand is a classical humanitarian photographer and so his methodology is about 'embracing' the subject. And definitely, I love the word 'spice' to describe the aesthetics of his pictures, considering the exotic places he makes them. But it doesn't ring as true with Brohm in my mind.
    I do often use a teeny bit of hyperbole in my posts...

    You didn't mention anything however on inviting me over for dinner and cooking me steak. That must have been an oversight????
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by blansky View Post
    You didn't mention anything however on inviting me over for dinner and cooking me steak. That must have been an oversight????
    I like my men tough. Too saucy?
    'Cows are very fond of being photographed, and, unlike architecture, don't move.' - Oscar Wilde

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by batwister View Post
    I like my men tough. Too saucy?
    Wow. A match made in heaven.
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

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