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  1. #21
    Richard Sintchak (rich815)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry S View Post
    Hey you kids, get off my lawn!
    Ha.
    -----------------------

    "Well, my photos are actually much better than they look..."

    Richard S.
    Albany, CA (San Francisco bay area)

    My Flickr River of photographs
    http://flickriver.com/photos/rich815...r-interesting/

    My Photography Website
    http://www.lightshadowandtone.com

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirius Glass View Post
    I get especially annoyed by those at APUG who swear that it is good to save money by using dish washing liquid instead of PhotoFlo and by using Borax instead of the chemicals supplied by photographic companies. Not only are they hurting the people that do not know better, but they are also reducing the market for companies like Kodak and Ilford.
    hey steve

    whenever someone states in a thread they use jet dry or dawn or fruit fresh or whatever they are using
    instead of photo flow or vit c or ? pretty much every response tells them they are making a mistake
    and to use the intended ingredient. im not sure how that could be skewed to be " sure do this, it works "

    i do think there is a difference between skimping on a chemical ingredient
    and using outdated film or a toy camera, a huge difference, but then again
    i always hear people tell me that i am wasting my time and money not using
    fresh film+paper and a "normal" chemicals or a camera that isnt' a POS


    john

  3. #23

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    Cheapskates and tightwads

    I had never heard the terms re-mixed.

  4. #24
    Ken Nadvornick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whowantstoast View Post
    I'm a big believer in doing the best you can at whatever level you can afford.
    "Do what you can, with what you have, where you are."
    — Theodore Roosevelt

    So much wisdom in only eleven short words...

    Ken
    "There is very limited audience for the arty stuff, and it is largely comprised of other arty types, most of whom have no money to spend because no one is buying their stuff either. More people bring their emotions to an image than bring their intellect. The former are the folks who have checkbooks because they are engineers, accountants, and bankers—and generally they are engineers, accountants and bankers because they are not artists."

    — Amanda Tomlin, Looking Glass Magazine, 2014

  5. #25
    TheFlyingCamera's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cliveh View Post
    In the last few years I’ve noticed quite a few people using a DSLR with the lens hood back to front on the end of the lens. Perhaps all the DSLR users I’ve seen doing this are doing it intentionally. But this does seem a shame, when it would only take a few seconds to reverse it.
    I think it's like wearing a ball cap backwards, or pants so low your boxer shorts are showing, and you're belting them around your thighs to avoid getting in legal trouble - fashion statement, you know?

  6. #26
    NedL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerald C Koch View Post
    In a classic installment of I Love Lucy, Ricky gets so angry with Lucy that he mutilates the expressions cheap skate and tight wad. Which brings me to the reason for this post.

    I really can't understand how people can risk their photographs by cutting corners. Usually it is not a matter of cost but a warped mindset that they have beaten the system. It can be trying to get that 37th exposure or dilution of developer or fixer beyond the manufacturers recommendations or using old and very fogged film. There are many other examples. Quite frankly I can't understand how they justify their actions. There is a difference in being frugal and being cheap.
    First off, I agree with you. Someone mentioned xtol above and that was a good example. And for me, the price of film is trivial compared to my cost in time and making prints. Yet I catch myself noticing the price of film. ( I don't think I'll be saying that with larger format films however! ) I agree with your examples, especially trying to get the 37th exposure ( if it's an important picture ) or overusing fixer with something that matters.

    I wanted to point out something different which is not being cheap or even frugal. I get a lot of enjoyment from doing things myself. So, for example, my easels and negative carriers are homemade. I absolutely can afford to buy brand new ones if I want to, but that wouldn't be as much fun and wouldn't be as satisfying. I don't go out and buy crap cameras, but I do like using my folders and autographic cameras. Trying to make a good photograph with them, and the different look the old uncoated lenses have is very fun. I've got an old duaflex and a brownie, and it's fun to try to use them too, sometimes. I have a pinhole camera that I made out of a coffee can. Making pictures with that is one of the funnest things I do in photography... I love it.. there's a huge freedom and lack of "expectation of perfection" and even a sense of "discovering" something instead of creating it. Making a camera out of a can and using photo paper in it might sound like the height of cheapness, but it has nothing to do with being cheap and everything to do with having fun. Having fun using the camera is the goal in and of itself.

    I don't disagree, but I do think occasionally the "do it yourself" person gets mistaken for a cheapskate, when really the motivation is completely different.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirius Glass View Post
    I get especially annoyed by those at APUG who swear that it is good to save money by using dish washing liquid instead of PhotoFlo and by using Borax instead of the chemicals supplied by photographic companies. Not only are they hurting the people that do not know better, but they are also reducing the market for companies like Kodak and Ilford.
    I hardly think using 20 mule team equates with using exhausted solutions or outdated color materials. I'm sure people have experienced a wide range of results from the latter, from good-as-new to entirely unacceptable. The drawbacks of Borax AFAIK are entirely "theoretical"-many people including myself have used it for years or decades without any trouble, and the reports of less than adequate performance are few, if any.

  8. #28
    Steve Smith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zsas View Post
    One cost more than even mentioning.....the other, well, I keep its price tag on the back to remind me......
    I bought an Olympus XA4 for the same price (well, pence instead of cents).


    Steve.
    "People who say things won't work are a dime a dozen. People who figure out how to make things work are worth a fortune" - Dave Rat.

  9. #29
    Mark Fisher's Avatar
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    I have a very different take on this. If you are a beginner, start with good quality, fresh stuff......brand name SLR, 50mm lens, fresh Kodak/Ilford/Fuji film, Ilford MGIV paper, and fresh chemistry for every session with stock within date. If you do that while learning, the quality is all about you. This stuff all works and the quality control is perfect. There is no second guessing. After you learn, you can do whatever you want. Crappy cameras, old chemistry, etc can be part of the creative process if you know how it all works. Personally, I only use material and equipment I know well (crap or otherwise). I prefer to be creative with the stuff I can control than random chance. Random chance more often gives me crap than art!
    Your first 10,000 pictures are the worst - HCB

    www.markjamesfisher.com

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Fisher View Post
    I have a very different take on this. If you are a beginner, start with good quality, fresh stuff......brand name SLR, 50mm lens, fresh Kodak/Ilford/Fuji film, Ilford MGIV paper, and fresh chemistry for every session with stock within date. If you do that while learning, the quality is all about you. This stuff all works and the quality control is perfect. There is no second guessing. After you learn, you can do whatever you want. Crappy cameras, old chemistry, etc can be part of the creative process if you know how it all works. Personally, I only use material and equipment I know well (crap or otherwise). I prefer to be creative with the stuff I can control than random chance. Random chance more often gives me crap than art!
    Agreed entirely! There have been a few folks seen here and on other photo forums who start out by trying to break the rules before they know the rules. Those folks have almost always ended up frustrated and unsuccessfull. I'm all for creativity but in almost all endeavors one must understand the basics at more than just an academic level before getting too creative.

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