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  1. #21
    kwmullet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by get_me_a_gun
    that doesnt mean she cant share the wealth! i need to spend $$s on photo stuff , not that im bitching, im just saying she has money she should share it.
    Sounds like a good twilight zone episode, to me.

    She's got money. You want money. Therefore, she should give you money because she took your picture.

    I wonder if your sentiments would be the same in 20 years or so if everyone recognizable in every photograph you ever took made a career of chasing you down for their cut every time one of your images won an award, was published somewhere or was displayed in a gallery.

    I wonder if the the surviving solders in these Joe Rosenthal photographs of a flag raising on Mt. Suribachi at Iwo Jima spent much time tracking him (and now his estate) down over the years for their cut each time an image made a buck because they're recognizable in an image. I'd be willing to guess not, that they probably saw things in a little broader scope.

    I wonder if the decendants of Lisa Gherardini ring up the estate of Leonardo DaVinci for a few Euro whenever an image of the Mona Lisa appears somewhere and they're a bit low on cash.

    It would be one thing if you entered into a financial agreement with you as the model and she as the photographer, but since neither of you did so, it sounds like little more than envy and resentment to me.

    -KwM-

  2. #22
    Derek Lofgreen's Avatar
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    Build bridges, don't burn them.

    D.
    My Photography Site www.lofgreenimages.com and My Blog

  3. #23
    c6h6o3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by don sigl
    First lesson when working with models:
    Make sure you get a signed release
    I feel that models should be paid for their work at the time of the shoot. I'm perfectly willing to build in a percentage of any royalties I receive for the photographs which result into the model release agreement. The probability of earning any is so low that I can afford to be magnanimous in this regard.

    But Don's admonition is the heart of the matter, to wit: NOBODY has any chance of making any money without that release. No publisher will touch a photograph without one. In fact, I'm surprised that the contest which awarded the prize was willing to consider it without one.

  4. #24

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    I think that you were treated shabbily. Put it behind you.
    Claire (Ms Anne Thrope is in the darkroom)

  5. #25
    djklmnop's Avatar
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    I think it's great that the photographer won the competition, but I think it is extremely irresponsible of her to not consult the model beforehand.

    There are so many ways you can look at the situation. The model has every right to decide whether or not her image is used. I have photographed a lot of models and have done nudes as well. One model expressed that her photos are to never be shown to anyone which I have always respected. The whole idea of the shoot was for me to practice my photography. I assume the same for these two students. If that wasn't the case, all of us could deceivingly take photography class, photograph our classmates and submit them to competitions.

    Another thing to consider is that photo competitions are never private. If you're winning $1000.00, you can bet your ass on it that whoever is giving you $1,000.00 is gonna use that photo in all its advertising and promos. There's no such thing as a free meal. In fact, I'm willing to bet that there is a disclaimer on the entry form stating that the photographer keeps all right to his image, but the magazine/competition holder shares those rights for any use they feel necessary in promoting themselves. This probably is not limited to posters, banner ads, flyers, etc. And most competitions indicate that the photographer must have any necessary documents supporting the image, such a release forms. Luckily for the competition holder, submitting the image is in itself an agreement to the terms. The model had no opportunity to read any fine print when she was photographed.

    Personally, I would simply bring it up to the photographer and see her response. Screaming for a share is not a good way to present yourself. But if anyone is smart enough to win a competition, should be smart enough to read your concern and intent.

    Recalling an earlier poster: Remeber the Robert Doisneau's photo? The kiss. We had a thread on this topic as well. She sued him!

    It is our responsibility as photographers to make sure we have full approval before doing anything. But then again, the op clearly wants money. Had it won first place with no money, would there be this much hostility?

    Andy
    Money is not the problem. The problem is, I don't have any.

  6. #26
    thebanana's Avatar
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    roteague and blansky have both given you sound professional advice on this matter. There's not much more to be said.
    "While you're out there smashing the state, don't forget to keep a smile on your lips and a song in your heart!"

  7. #27
    david b's Avatar
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    Let's all remember we are getting one side to the story.

  8. #28

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    If commercial use is made of your image without your consent then you may well have grounds to sue both the photographer and the commercial user.

    Is there a Legal Aid Society near you?
    Claire (Ms Anne Thrope is in the darkroom)

  9. #29
    Ed Sukach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djklmnop
    ... In fact, I'm willing to bet that there is a disclaimer on the entry form stating that the photographer keeps all right to his image, but the magazine/competition holder shares those rights for any use they feel necessary in promoting themselves.
    Not usually. Most of these "contests" have an agreement stating that all work submitted, and the RIGHTS accompanying that work, are the property of those conducting the Contest. These contests are a way of obtaining LOTS of images for a Stock Photograph outfit.

    I think trying to get part of the prize money from the photographer would be difficult, although you may very well have a legal right to a fair share (usually something like 5 - 10%). Certainly it would be a "moral" thing to share ... I would have no problem with that. If those images are published, I think your chances of recovering for damages are greatly increased, from both the photographer and the Contest people.
    Carpe erratum!!

    Ed Sukach, FFP.

  10. #30
    david b's Avatar
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    wow...aren't you glad you asked?

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