Am I allowed to say my opinion, or no?
To me it makes sense. It doesn't have to make sense to you. In fact, I don't care if it does or not.
If you read my original post more carefully you would have remembered that it is MY opinion that fine art is about the practice, the hard work. If completely and fully realizing your vision comes so easy for you that you hardly have to pay any effort for it, then good for you. I don't personally know anybody like that. The people I know that like practicing their art, work very hard at it to get to where they want to be. Call it blood, sweat, and tears if you want. What else is the purpose of being an artist, if not to work hard on the craft that you love?
You're making fine art out of arguing, by the way. But I will not come back to this thread. I've got better things to do.
Originally Posted by Q.G.
"Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank
"Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman
"...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh
you should know by not on page 7 of the thread
that if you don't "agree" you are wrong.
I don't know what makes a " fine art" photograph, all I do know is too many people try to make them when they can't even make fine photographs.
If you don't agree, you might want to participate in the discussion, and share why you don't, and point out where others are wrong.
Originally Posted by jnanian
Wanting to be allowed to state your opinion (noone even suggests you are not, except you, Thomas), and allowing others to disagree and state their opposing opinion, are one and the same thing.
At least they should be.
And it is what distinguishes a discussion from a poll, Keith.
No one wants to silence anyone. Quite on the contrary, it'd be nice if a discussion had balanced participation from lots of different people.
Enjoying a discussion without becoming argumentative is an unspoken piece of 'threadiquette' that sometimes gets neglected and inevitably leads to harsh words. If they feel like they're getting talked over, some members check out or click the 'ignore' button. That's unfortunate, when so many excellent opinions may be read here.
Let me suggest that those who have extended, deep and brilliant thoughts on this or other subjects might create a blog essay. After 16+ comments in a thread, I assume that a person would have plenty of material to refine into a nice article, and I am sure we'd all read it
Another point is that if I landed in this thread, I'd be especially interested in the thoughts of those people who are known contributors of exceptional photographs in the galleries and portfolios.
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all photographers are journalists ... and depending on who is looking
Originally Posted by Q.G.
at their images, they can all be considered "fine artists".
it is all subjective.
Oy! Who knew I'd open such a can of worms? And I'm still confused...
What is art as opposed to fine art? How are those concepts defined through photography? Who defines it? Like many others who have posted to this thread, I don't know that it can be defined in a way that is (mostly) agreeable to all, and I'm not sure that I would agree with it anyway.
Am I photographer? Absolutely. Am I an artist? I don't know. But I'm going to keep working on what it means to me. This thread, for all it's to- and fro-ing has provided a lot of different insights for me to chew on for a while.
My favorite thing is to go where I've never been. D. Arbus
I think you are right Keith. One thing I have observed, however, is that many APUG threads do not really involve much discussion at all, but rather just a series of people stating their views and not really interacting with the thoughts of others at all. Not always, but quite often. I agree that unnecessarily argumentative or repetitive posts can be tiresome. But as long as there is respect and a bit of tact, I think it is nice to see discussions with a bit of spirit sometimes, especially when lots of people are chipping in. I reckon it can actually make the place feel more like a community, rather than less. Just a thought...
Originally Posted by keithwms
Not sure that I would need to see someone's work before taking their thoughts on a philosophical question as seriously as anyone else's...
Originally Posted by keithwms
But I take the hint. It is about time that I for one got off my behind and embraced digital to the extent necessary to scan and post some images here!
Creating pictures that have content is not easy.
At exhibitions of photoclubs I see a lot of pics that are snapshots taken. But there is no real interest in the subject that is shot. For instance when you shoot a pic of a building with a certain shape, you will have to investigate first why the shape is made as it is. Who is the architect. If these questions are answered you probably will make a different pic of the building that contains more info than a snapshot.
I am also strugling with this last weeks. My technical skills are becoming to a professional level now after learning the last 2 years, and now the time is right to look further. "My wife asks me when I am going to create beautifull images in stead of technical perfect images..."
Could a coach help to get you on the right path?
They look from a different point at you work and might be of help.
Wait a minute....Did someone say can of worms.....mmmmmmmmmmm......
"Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."
- Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)